University tuition fees and Scottish Independence. Not sustainable

[polo mint]

Last night I was watching a programme on the BBC regarding students applying to Scottish universities and the fees that they were required to pay.

 

Students living in Scotland don't pay fees. Those from the rest of the UK do.

Similarly students from outside the EU are charged fees. However those from the EU can apply to Scottish universities without facing fees. That is EU law.

 

At the moment very few EU nationals apply because of the language barrier. However there are some UK nationals who are resident in other EU countries. They can apply for free tuition at Scottish universities.

 

Of course if Scotland became an independant country within the EU Scottish universities would no longer be able to charge a fee to English, Welsh and Northern Irish students as they would also be citizens of other EU countries.

 

Scottish universities would no longer be able to discriminate against English students and with no language barrier there would be a rush which I assume would make free tuition in Scotland non viable.

 

Anyone got any thoughts on the matter?

[anywebsite]

I can understand how it doesn't break EU law to charge English, Welsh and Northern Irish students more than Scottish students now.

 

It would be funny if Scotland voted 'yes', but I don't think it'll happen.

[polo mint]

I can understand how it doesn't break EU law to charge English, Welsh and Northern Irish students more than Scottish students now.

 

It would be funny if Scotland voted 'yes', but I don't think it'll happen.

 

EU law only requires that a country treats citizens from other EU countries the same as its own.

 

As Scotland is part of the UK, it is the UK that is required to provide equal treatment at any UK university. So the UK can chose to offer different fees to its own citizens but not to those from other EU countries.

 

Scotland currently has around 16000 overseas EU students and this costs Scottish taxpayers £75 million to educate them. Scotland currently has around 250,000 university places. It also has less than 10% of the UK population, so it could easily be swamped by 200,000 plus applications from the UK. This would hugely increase the cost to the Scotish taxpayer as well as forcing many Scotish students to pay fees at UK universities.

[Riannon]

EU law only requires that a country treats citizens from other EU countries the same as its own.

 

As Scotland is part of the UK, it is the UK that is required to provide equal treatment at any UK university. So the UK can chose to offer different fees to its own citizens but not to those from other EU countries.

 

Scotland currently has around 16000 overseas EU students and this costs Scottish taxpayers £75 million to educate them. Scotland currently has around 250,000 university places. It also has less than 10% of the UK population, so it could easily be swamped by 200,000 plus applications from the UK. This would hugely increase the cost to the Scotish taxpayer as well as forcing many Scotish students to pay fees at UK universities.

 

I suppose it follows that as English universities have more than 100,000 students from other EU countries our tuition fees are saving UK tax payers £1/2 billion in the cost of educating non UK nationals, and were it not for those detered by the fees it would likely be a damned sight more.

[Rob_Roy]

EU law only requires that a country treats citizens from other EU countries the same as its own.

 

As Scotland is part of the UK, it is the UK that is required to provide equal treatment at any UK university. So the UK can chose to offer different fees to its own citizens but not to those from other EU countries.

 

Scotland currently has around 16000 overseas EU students and this costs Scottish taxpayers £75 million to educate them. Scotland currently has around 250,000 university places. It also has less than 10% of the UK population, so it could easily be swamped by 200,000 plus applications from the UK. This would hugely increase the cost to the Scotish taxpayer as well as forcing many Scotish students to pay fees at UK universities.

 

Last time I checked, Scotland was part of the UK, so already has 200,000+ UK students and Scottish students are charged fees at UK universities (but not the ones in that part of the UK known as Scotland).

[polo mint]

Last time I checked, Scotland was part of the UK, so already has 200,000+ UK students and Scottish students are charged fees at UK universities (but not the ones in that part of the UK known as Scotland).

 

I think you are somewhat missing the point.

[Rob_Roy]

I think you are somewhat missing the point.

 

I didn't. I agree with your point that Scottish Universities would be swamped with applications from those outwith Scotland (although it doesn't mean they have to accept them).

 

However, you referred to the "UK" more than once with the implication that Scotland isn't part of it, which it obviously is. Furthermore, if Scotland separates from the UK then there will be no UK left as NI is a province and Wales is a principality.

 

I'm probably being over-sensitive here and you weren't trying to imply anything so just ignore my previous post.

 

And I do agree with you that it will provide an interesting situation, if separation occurs.

[polo mint]

I didn't. I agree with your point that Scottish Universities would be swamped with applications from those outwith Scotland (although it doesn't mean they have to accept them).

 

However, you referred to the "UK" more than once with the implication that Scotland isn't part of it, which it obviously is. Furthermore, if Scotland separates from the UK then there will be no UK left as NI is a province and Wales is a principality.

 

I'm probably being over-sensitive here and you weren't trying to imply anything so just ignore my previous post.

 

And I do agree with you that it will provide an interesting situation, if separation occurs.

 

I think you will find that my references to the UK were pretty clearly divided into the current situation UK and a UK that didn't contain Scotland. But never mind we appear to be singing from the same hymn sheet.

 

Incidentally an independent Scotland would not be able to discriminate against applications from over the border. It is clearly written into the treaty of Rome. So if a candidate from the uk (after partition) had better qualifications than a Scottish applicant, the UK applicant would have to be offered the place.

[Rob_Roy]

I think you will find that my references to the UK were pretty clearly divided into the current situation UK and a UK that didn't contain Scotland. But never mind we appear to be singing from the same hymn sheet.

 

Incidentally an independent Scotland would not be able to discriminate against applications from over the border. It is clearly written into the treaty of Rome. So if a candidate from the uk (after partition) had better qualifications than a Scottish applicant, the UK applicant would have to be offered the place.

 

My bold......it shouldn't present too many problems then .

 

Being serious: if separation occurs then they would have to re-think their current policy.

[truman]

My bold......it shouldn't present too many problems then .

 

Being serious: if separation occurs then they would have to re-think their current policy.

 

Yep,not sure if an independent Scotland could fund free uni places?