katkin100 Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 Ive been reading with some interest and I am nowhere near an expert but the example below springs to mind. What would happen if you had an illness which effects you differently on different days, you have 1 good day, where you are more able, in 10, for example. The day you are assessed is a good day. The assessment would suggest i am able, but on average i am not, this could be ignored without my diagnosis, i would therefore assume my diagnosis should have some impact on my ability to work. The Fonz has hit upon one of the major criticisms disabled people have of the assessments which is that they don't take into account conditions which fluctuate. As HeadingNorth pointed out of course you should talk about this in the assessment but the assessor has to fill in a very rigid computerised form which is essentially ticking boxes with very simple yes or no answers to questions. You can give them a long and elaborate explanation of how you condition varies from day to day and they can understand what you are saying but they are forced to sum that up to ticking a box and awarding you a number of points. Your full answer is not recorded and it is difficult for the assessor to apply their common sense or really treat people on a case by case basis. Even if the assessment is based on an average day and the results show that on an average day you can work. If you bad days where you cannot do your job, even if that is only 10% of the time that is going to add up to a lot of time off and at unpredictable moments. Of course that is going to be very annoying for employers as they will feel you are unreliable as an employee even if they understand that it is not your fault. If an employer is told someone is fit for work and hires that person and then finds they are often off sick they may become distrustful of assessments and be unwilling to hire other disabled people, even those who have stable conditions and really are fit for work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
verydull Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 you make a good point katkin, surely then the best people for this job are not the health practioners, but major employers? surely they would have a pretty clear idea of what is needed to be able to cope with a day to day working life? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juniee Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 it would also help if the assessors told the truth instead of making some things up also agree no room to put down on the form what you actually stated when you go to court you are told to tell the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth if any of these people had money to spare someone could take these assessors to court for libel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheff1johnny Posted April 26, 2012 Share Posted April 26, 2012 Contrary to what stupid Americans think, Asperger's is NOT a "disease". as there is NO cure. My disability is for life, and no un-qualified jobsworth from ATOS or Job Centre Plus can tell me any different. there are lots of diseases and disabillities without cures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheff1johnny Posted April 26, 2012 Share Posted April 26, 2012 End of the day, we have a moral duty in society to aid the most vunerable and make sure they are supported and that is what any decent society should do. But I object to my taxes being used by the workshy, so they can get tanked up in the daytime, or smoking canabis while I am being taxed to the eyeballs. Yes, support then genuinely disabled and the sick. NO, to supporting the ones who have been taking the mick Well said, but the questions are asked in such a way, that no-oe could answer them. The only people clever enough to pass the medical are probably the fraudsters. The medical needs updating, as its an unfair assesment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zippy Posted April 26, 2012 Share Posted April 26, 2012 Contrary to what stupid Americans think, Asperger's is NOT a "disease". as there is NO cure. My disability is for life, and no un-qualified jobsworth from ATOS or Job Centre Plus can tell me any different. well here's the problem , ATOS doesn't employ 'unqualified jobsworth's ' to do the assessments does it ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheff1johnny Posted April 27, 2012 Share Posted April 27, 2012 FOR ZIPPY: It is probably fair to say that is a renumeration to find people fit for work, at atos. How much, or how little is yet to be divulged, maybe you could tell us, as you seem to know most other things Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
julesmarie Posted April 27, 2012 Share Posted April 27, 2012 I am at the moment going the appeal process, my illness I have is incurable, and so ill most of the days it gets me so down. After filling in the claim forms, and going to the medical, then being told I was fit for work, even my doctors cannot believe it. I have worked from leaving school, and had a really good paid job,until been diagnosed with my illness, I wish hadn't got and would loved to have been able to carry on working. Then after the medical and been able to lift my arms, and bend my knees, having no stick or wheelchair, i'm fit, but I never claimed to be disabled, my claim is i'm too sick most of the days, and who would employ someone who has to take time off work constantly. No qualified person in my illness has been contacted, as the ATOS don't do this, they don't even want a medical report from my doctors, I just have to keep sending sick notes in, which isn't a problem, but the atos have put more pressure on GP's, by all that have been turned down, have to have an appointment to receive the sick notes. Incapacity at least you had a medical with a qualified doctor, not a employee who just filled in your form at a computer. just to add, on receiving the letter informing me about not entitled to ESA, they added that they recognise I have a disability and or health condition, but i didn't score enough points . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juniee Posted April 27, 2012 Share Posted April 27, 2012 go to the site after atos and see what is really happening my thoughts are with you as i cannot see the point of reassessing people with incurable illness and how on earth this system has been allowed here is beyond my understanding it has been banned in 15 states in the usa and the company has been heavily fined in other countries Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
julesmarie Posted April 27, 2012 Share Posted April 27, 2012 go to the site after atos and see what is really happening my thoughts are with you as i cannot see the point of reassessing people with incurable illness and how on earth this system has been allowed here is beyond my understanding it has been banned in 15 states in the usa and the company has been heavily fined in other countries Thankyou juniee, I have had a look at after atos, and amazed its a French company, that runs it, reaping in 100 millions a year. why pay a foreign company to do what British could do ??? its been abig help to me again thankyou. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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