*_ash_* Posted April 20, 2012 Share Posted April 20, 2012 Pakistan is an independent country nowadays, we can only have so much influence. The worst we could threaten is expelling them from the commonwealth & it's not really a fate worse than death. All we can do is try to maintain good diplomatic relations & try to encourage them to do right. I'm not really in favour of foreign aid as bribery to do what we want, especially with nuclear armed powers, but it's one of the only tools we have. Britain doesn't rule the world & we can't stop everything wrong that happens on the other side of the world. I think we're a good 50 or 60 years past taking responsibility for what happens in Pakistan. Precisely, and that would do nothing to help corruption within judicial systems. If (for example) an officer is earning the equivalent of £1k, and someone offers them a bribe of £20k to turn a blind eye, then I would guess that most would take it. People talk of rich/poor divide in this country as being horrendous when in fact, compared to many societies, it is uncomparable. It is our own lack of knowledge to what reality is actually like for most countries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rupert_Baehr Posted April 20, 2012 Share Posted April 20, 2012 I have a number of Pakistani acquaintances who live in Pakistan. They are nothing like the Pakistani low-life who commit such horrendous crimes against their families in the UK. I also know a number of 'better educated' Pakistanis in the UK [and here in the US] they too are nothing like the trash who commit those crimes in the UK. It's not the fault of the Pakistani people that there are large numbers of poorly-educated, poorly-assimilated people in the UK. - Blame that on the last government which brought them in, told them they could do what the hell they liked, made no attempt to assimilate them and then wondered why they behaved like uncivilised chavs. Do you really think the Pakistani government sent their best and brightest to do menial work in the UK? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spooky3 Posted April 20, 2012 Author Share Posted April 20, 2012 I decided to watch the video. It described a woman who committed suicide last week - her burns were absolutely unbelievable . I suspect that's why this story has made press now. ... mmm, that's on News24, for some reason I kept turning to look at that point, horrific! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spooky3 Posted April 20, 2012 Author Share Posted April 20, 2012 ... The sort of people who would consider mutilating non-compliant female family members are not 'ordinary' Pakistanis - they are primitives and their behaviour would not be tolerated in middle-class Pakistani society. The people who behave like this are the dregs of Pakistani Society ... ... You'd be hard pushed to find any people of any origin who aren't disgusted about this, but that in itself won't change things. It may be a peaceful religious country, but it isn't the country who committed these offenses. It is individuals, just as every country has criminals. ... You are both absolutely correct, non of the Pakistanis I know would dream or condone anything like this. And it's exactly these people who can start to push for more regulation and openness, whether that is through their social networks or political. In my experience Pakistanis are very proud and really care about reputation, so a few influential words could really start a ball rolling. Just the thought of that image is bringing a tear to my eye... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anywebsite Posted April 20, 2012 Share Posted April 20, 2012 Precisely, and that would do nothing to help corruption within judicial systems. If (for example) an officer is earning the equivalent of £1k, and someone offers them a bribe of £20k to turn a blind eye, then I would guess that most would take it. People talk of rich/poor divide in this country as being horrendous when in fact, compared to many societies, it is uncomparable. It is our own lack of knowledge to what reality is actually like for most countries. Britain isn't the power it was 100 years ago, back then we were colonial rulers, so we did have influence & responsibility for what happened in Pakistan. We still have a little influence through the commonwealth, diplomats & foreign aid, but that's all. We can't re-invade them. We have our own corruption to sort out in our own country before we should worry too much about Pakistan, it's not that incomparable, the numbers might be different & the incidence lower, but we can't pretend that similar things don't happen here. Pakistan is a very corrupt country, horrible things happen there, but there isn't a lot we can do about it. We can change our own country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johncocker Posted April 20, 2012 Share Posted April 20, 2012 the only way you'd have any hope of stopping it in a place like pakistan is have their "spiritual" leaders to declare its anti islamic and you'll go to hell ,evoke sharia law and have acid poured on the face of the perpetrators. we did have an influence once when we were the evil imperialists in india by banning and eradicating the insane practice of "suttee" in india. as for influence these days maybe we could get someone like halibut to go over there and councel them on a more user friendly humane fluid they could use to throw in their faces . maybe something like tizer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rupert_Baehr Posted April 20, 2012 Share Posted April 20, 2012 You are both absolutely correct, non of the Pakistanis I know would dream or condone anything like this. And it's exactly these people who can start to push for more regulation and openness, whether that is through their social networks or political. In my experience Pakistanis are very proud and really care about reputation, so a few influential words could really start a ball rolling. Just the thought of that image is bringing a tear to my eye... I understand most of that - but what was the bit about 'brings a tear to my eye'? - That I did not understand. This may sound simplistic (perhaps it's a bit better?) Racism is - to me - a debilitating disease. If I was the boss of something and I did the hiring and 'racism' figured then were I to allow 'Prejudice' (Race. colour. creed. height. gender or anything else ) to colour my selection, then (statistically - if I hired enough of them - I would damage my chances of hiring the best people. (I can do the maths!) My Pakisatani friends are just that. Friends. Some live in Pakistan, some live elsewhere. Many of the Pakistani immigrants who came to the UK were not (perhaps) the sharpest tools in the box, but they were the tools who were chosen. They were the people the British asked for and they were the people they got. If the British government failed to mould the clay, it's the potter's fault - not the fault of the wheel.- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spooky3 Posted April 20, 2012 Author Share Posted April 20, 2012 I understand most of that - but what was the bit about 'brings a tear to my eye'? - That I did not understand. This may sound simplistic (perhaps it's a bit better?) Racism is - to me - a debilitating disease. If I was the boss of something and I did the hiring and 'racism' figured then were I to allow 'Prejudice' (Race. colour. creed. height. gender or anything else ) to colour my selection, then (statistically - if I hired enough of them - I would damage my chances of hiring the best people. (I can do the maths!) My Pakisatani friends are just that. Friends. Some live in Pakistan, some live elsewhere. Many of the Pakistani immigrants who came to the UK were not (perhaps) the sharpest tools in the box, but they were the tools who were chosen. They were the people the British asked for and they were the people they got. If the British government failed to mould the clay, it's the potter's fault - not the fault of the wheel.- Have you not seen the pictures of that girl who recently committed suicide because her disfiguration was so so severe after having acid thrown at her by her husband? She been in hospital something like 12 times to have reconstructive surgery, but she was still very very bad. This is nothing to do with racism, why would you twist it so? This story was on late night News24 all last night, it was truly disturbing! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreenyGreen Posted April 20, 2012 Share Posted April 20, 2012 We have a large Pakistani community who all seem to have strong connections with Pakistan, how can educated brits not influence this despicable routine practice...? Really? I've lots of Asian 'Pakistani' friends and their country they care for is Britain, no-one else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank Sidney Posted April 20, 2012 Share Posted April 20, 2012 They won't listen to us. The only think we can do is ensure it doesn't spread to here. However, this isn't working either with the large number of "Honour Killings" Pakistan is a basket case of a country where the government talks with fork tongue.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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