I1L2T3 Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 Are you suggesting we just stop cutting, go back to brown level of spending ? Borrow more (at a higher level of interest as our AAA rating goes down the tubes) and hope it works ? Get the banks to keep dishing out billions ? I'm no economist so I don't know. Do you know ? No, I've never said we should stop cutting. I think we need well-reasoned and well-targeted efficiencies. Austerity is too strong an approach - we need to make the cuts that are really needed but we also need to stimulate the economy too. A plan for growth not magic pixie dust supply-side idiocy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I1L2T3 Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 Because the bank bailouts have nothing to do with the need for austerity. They are a one off which in time will be repaid with a modest profit. That's what I and others have been trying to explain, we don't need austerity because of the banks, we need it because labour ran up a massive public deficit. We were spending over £150 billion a year more than we were earning with borrowed money and ever increasing debt service costs when Brown was finally prised out of Downing Street. We cannot continue to do that. If you want to live in a fantasy world where everthing is the fault of bankers and the magic money tree should never run out no matter how much more than we earn we spend then I suggest taking advantage of the freedom of movement the EU grants and relocating to Greece for the next 6 months and see how the endgame of that head in the sand approach pans out. If we hadn't had the banking crisis we wouldn't be having austerity now. You really need to make that basic connection to understand what is going on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrSmith Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 Explain why you support it. Because I didn’t want the government to spend more than they had in the first place, I would rather they just spend what they have and stop borrowing. It doesn’t bother me if the economy isn’t growing, there’s more to life than money and everyone needs to start living within their means. I would support them cutting it by more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andygardener Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 If we hadn't had the banking crisis we wouldn't be having austerity now. You really need to make that basic connection to understand what is going on. So once the banks have repaid all their loans and the nationalised banks have been sold at a profit a massive budget deficit will be just fine then? Not a problem, lets carry on like Pa Broon digging and digging the hole of debt and ever increasing the percentage of GDP spent on servicing that debt till we lose an A or two on the old credit rating, and suddenly the debt repayments that where bigger than the defence budget are now bigger than the NHS budget, then maybe get into b territory and now it's rivalling the pensions budget because God forbid we should think about actually living within our means. Seriously, take a holiday to Greece this year and take a look at the future you are proposing for Britain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinfoilhat Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 No, I've never said we should stop cutting. I think we need well-reasoned and well-targeted efficiencies. Austerity is too strong an approach - we need to make the cuts that are really needed but we also need to stimulate the economy too. A plan for growth not magic pixie dust supply-side idiocy. Are you suggesting the very best economists of Europe (well, Germany mostly) have it all wrong ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I1L2T3 Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 Because I didn’t want the government to spend more than they had in the first place, I would rather they just spend what they have and stop borrowing. It doesn’t bother me if the economy isn’t growing, there’s more to life than money and everyone needs to start living within their means. I would support them cutting it by more. So naive. Governments always spend more than they have. Show me a government that doesn't, or a country that has no national debt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucifer Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 Wolfgang Schäuble, German finance minister on France - “We cannot renegotiate agreements after every election. Hollande knows that too. I have said that everybody who gets elected into office must be able to save face. So we will discuss this with Hollande in a friendly way. But we won’t change our principles.” And more sternly on Greece- “If Greek voters were to vote for a majority that does not honour those agreements, then Greece will have to bear the consequences. EU membership is voluntary,” I predict Eurozone implosion in 6 months or less. Maybe it's time for Germany to take over France again for the third time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I1L2T3 Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 Are you suggesting the very best economists of Europe (well, Germany mostly) have it all wrong ? Yes, in Europe they got it wrong with the introduction of the Euro. Absolutely they did. Everything since has been a disaster too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I1L2T3 Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 So once the banks have repaid all their loans and the nationalised banks have been sold at a profit a massive budget deficit will be just fine then? Not a problem, lets carry on like Pa Broon digging and digging the hole of debt and ever increasing the percentage of GDP spent on servicing that debt till we lose an A or two on the old credit rating, and suddenly the debt repayments that where bigger than the defence budget are now bigger than the NHS budget, then maybe get into b territory and now it's rivalling the pensions budget because God forbid we should think about actually living within our means. Seriously, take a holiday to Greece this year and take a look at the future you are proposing for Britain. We'll never be like Greece. That was never on the cards. Another stupid Tory scare story unfortunately. Sorry you've fallen for it. A notch off the credit rating would be justified. It's not the end of the world - look at the USA The nationalised banks will not be sold at a profit. You know that don't you. There were recent moves to start selling them off at knockdown prices to investors in Abu Dhabi. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrSmith Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 So naive. Governments always spend more than they have. Show me a government that doesn't, or a country that has no national debt. Its not naive, its what I want the governmnet to do no matter the concequeces. Liechtenstein Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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