MrSmith Posted June 15, 2012 Share Posted June 15, 2012 Are you going to blame God (or Nature) for people being murderers, child abusers etc.. ? If an omnipotent God did exist, then yes God would be to blame. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teddybare Posted June 15, 2012 Share Posted June 15, 2012 Over the past 50years haven't some homosexuals been volunteering for studies that attempted to cure their gayness? Regardless of whether god exists, wouldn't that suggest that a faction of homosexuals believe themselves that it was something that could be cured? And if so is that due to feelings of guilt on their part for something they believe is unnatural? If so, is this purely down to peer pressure/parenting or is it hard wired into the human brain to ensure the survival of our species? If homosexuality is a natural part of evolution, what purpose does it serve in a society where birth ratio boys:girls is almost perfectly split? Also, in modern times every state, feeling, emotion, everything, even obesity is being blamed on mental imbalances so why is it completely out of the question to suggest homosexuality is? I don't find homosexuality to be "against nature" as humans are by nature interested in and social with members of the same sex. In situations where there are no social consequences or rules, bisexuality and homosexuality occur frequently. I can understand why between women but struggle to comprehend being attracted to men in any circumstance as we're big hairy sweaty smelly horrible aggressive things. What I find odd is that someone would exclude the opposite sex completely from their list of potential partners and in some cases be repulsed by the idea of it. For example a friend claims he vomitted after copulation with a female as it was "disgusting". This seems unnatural to me and I can't see any evolutionary advantage for it. Unless it is a deliberate evolutionary disadvantage that removes excess men from the playing field so there are more women for the heteros to choose from/mate with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eater Sundae Posted June 15, 2012 Share Posted June 15, 2012 Over the past 50years haven't some homosexuals been volunteering for studies that attempted to cure their gayness? Regardless of whether god exists, wouldn't that suggest that a faction of homosexuals believe themselves that it was something that could be cured? And if so is that due to feelings of guilt on their part for something they believe is unnatural? If so, is this purely down to peer pressure/parenting or is it hard wired into the human brain to ensure the survival of our species? If homosexuality is a natural part of evolution, what purpose does it serve in a society where birth ratio boys:girls is almost perfectly split? Also, in modern times every state, feeling, emotion, everything, even obesity is being blamed on mental imbalances so why is it completely out of the question to suggest homosexuality is? I don't find homosexuality to be "against nature" as humans are by nature interested in and social with members of the same sex. In situations where there are no social consequences or rules, bisexuality and homosexuality occur frequently. I can understand why between women but struggle to comprehend being attracted to men in any circumstance as we're big hairy sweaty smelly horrible aggressive things. What I find odd is that someone would exclude the opposite sex completely from their list of potential partners and in some cases be repulsed by the idea of it. For example a friend claims he vomitted after copulation with a female as it was "disgusting". This seems unnatural to me and I can't see any evolutionary advantage for it. Unless it is a deliberate evolutionary disadvantage that removes excess men from the playing field so there are more women for the heteros to choose from/mate with. Remember there are not just gay men who are not on the playing field, there are gay women only. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teddybare Posted June 15, 2012 Share Posted June 15, 2012 Remember there are not just gay men who are not on the playing field, there are gay women only. Yes but historically they would have had no choice in the matter. So that doesn't work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evildrneil Posted June 15, 2012 Share Posted June 15, 2012 The shocking bit is that the person he found was a qualified psychologist. That's equivalent to finding a cancer doctor who recommends homeopathic treatments. Firstly she was a psychotherapist not a psychologist - they are two very different things. Secondly psychotherapy depends largely on context and shared belief frameworks. You probably wouldn't find many people who would consider, say, Freudianism to be anything other than a complete crock yet psychodynamic therapy does work for some people if it's a therapeutic framework they can buy into. You can't really equate psychotherapy with physical medication as it's very rarely based on any sort of robust scientific theory or even evidence (exceptions being the likes of CBT and CAT) so the comparison you are trying to make is invalid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeadingNorth Posted June 15, 2012 Share Posted June 15, 2012 Firstly she was a psychotherapist not a psychologist - they are two very different things. Secondly psychotherapy depends largely on context and shared belief frameworks. You probably wouldn't find many people who would consider, say, Freudianism to be anything other than a complete crock yet psychodynamic therapy does work for some people if it's a therapeutic framework they can buy into. You can't really equate psychotherapy with physical medication as it's very rarely based on any sort of robust scientific theory or even evidence (exceptions being the likes of CBT and CAT) so the comparison you are trying to make is invalid. Valid points. (At least, I assume they're valid; I can't tell a psychologist from a psychotherapist from a psychopath. ) But his underlying point, I think, is that it's fairly horrifying to know that anyone with such antiquated and offensive opinions could be holding any sort of position at all within the mental health services. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evildrneil Posted June 15, 2012 Share Posted June 15, 2012 But his underlying point, I think, is that it's fairly horrifying to know that anyone with such antiquated and offensive opinions could be holding any sort of position at all within the mental health services. The problem there is what people find a problem varies from person to person. If someone comes along with problem X then there will always be someone prepared to sell them a solution. Certainly such "therapies" shouldn't be part of the NHS but I don't really see how they can be (or even should be) excluded from the private sector. Undoubtedly it's a therapy that some people do find useful or the person in question wouldn't still be practicing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeadingNorth Posted June 15, 2012 Share Posted June 15, 2012 The problem there is what people find a problem varies from person to person. If someone comes along with problem X then there will always be someone prepared to sell them a solution. Isn't that rather the point? The very idea that someone would consider homosexuality as a problem, to be fixed, is anathema to any civilized country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evildrneil Posted June 15, 2012 Share Posted June 15, 2012 Isn't that rather the point? The very idea that someone would consider homosexuality as a problem, to be fixed, is anathema to any civilized country. With everything there's going to be a range of opinions - some people will think that homosexuality is a problem to be fixed including some homosexuals. Personally I wouldn't label it as a problem, other people do and that's their prerogative. Equally I wouldn't consider a big nose, small breasts or "sexual addiction" to be a problem but it doesn't stop some people from finding them to be problematic and others to charge them for "correcting" said problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
janie48 Posted June 15, 2012 Share Posted June 15, 2012 Isn't that rather the point? The very idea that someone would consider homosexuality as a problem, to be fixed, is anathema to any civilized country. I suppose its the fault of all!! Christians. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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