Time to leave the EU?

[MrSmith]

The Lib-Dems are the most europhile party. The only parties that advocate withdrawal are UKIP and the far right (BNP, NF and assorted other nutters). If the vast majority of people vote for parties that support staying in the EU then the UK stays in the EU. At the last election the pro-withdrawal parties got no MPs. That seems fairly conclusive.

 

That was my point, clearly the electorate want to stay in or they wouldn't keep voting for parties they vote for, unless they vote for the party that is most likely to keep the party out that they hate, in which case we will keep getting Labour and Conservative.

[truman]

That was my point, clearly the electorate want to stay in or they wouldn't keep voting for parties they vote for, unless they vote for the party that is most likely to keep the party out that they hate, in which case we will keep getting Labour and Conservative.

 

Unfortunately no single party has a manifesto that I completely agree with therefore I have to make compromises..as do most other voters I think..the EU is just one of a number of items that have to be taken into consideration..you can't pick one item from menu A and another from menu B etc etc..

[LeMaquis]

Im 42 and have been voting & paying tax for many years.

 

Not once have i agreed to £50million a day to be given to an undemocratic, federal system which cant even balance its books.

 

Its time for a referendum and an honest debate.

 

That's because you haven't agreed to anything other than by voting in elections. You weren't old enough for the 1975 referendum. You also haven't agreed to the Poll Tax, war in Iraq, continuation of the monarchy, abolition of South Yorkshire County Council, all the privatisations, bank bailouts and all the other decisions taken in our name. That's because our system is representative, not direct. You vote for a package and all the main parties oppose withdrawal from the EU. I think some MPs are worried that if there's a referendum on the EU there'll be demands for referenda on other issues.

 

The EU, by the way, has four main decision-making bodies, of which three are made up of elected representatives from member states. The Commission is appointed by governments but the Parliament, European Council and Council of Ministers are all either directly elected by respective electorates or made up of ministers and heads of state elected by respective electorates. To say it's undemocratic when it's mainly elected is simplistic Mailspeak.

[MrSmith]

Unfortunately no single party has a manifesto that I completely agree with therefore I have to make compromises..as do most other voters I think..the EU is just one of a number of items that have to be taken into consideration..you can't pick one item from menu A and another from menu B etc etc..

 

Yes that is unfortunate, what I would like to see when we vote is a list of very important issues that we can also vote on.

[Jeffrey Shaw]

If you're an EU enthusiast, please explain what was wrong with EFTA.

[LeMaquis]

That was my point, clearly the electorate want to stay in or they wouldn't keep voting for parties they vote for, unless they vote for the party that is most likely to keep the party out that they hate, in which case we will keep getting Labour and Conservative.

 

I'm not sure people necessarily want to stay in. I think at the moment a majority of people would want out but if a referendum took place I think the mood would shift when it became clear what withdrawal would mean in terms of trade. A debate would clear the air. People vote for a government and the EU is down the list of people's priorities. So although they may want out now few will vote UKIP as there are more important issues for them.

[Jeffrey Shaw]

And if HMG is deprived of powers by unelected Eurocrats, voting at General Elections is rendered meaningless.

Thus democracy is extinguished.

[LeMaquis]

If you're an EU enthusiast, please explain what was wrong with EFTA.

 

Over time EFTA has had ten members. Six have left and joined the EU. Today it has four members, fewer than the seven it started with. The EU has 27 members with others aspiring to join. History is not on EFTA's side.

[WeX]

I have friends in Norway and Switzerland the answer is yes, they are very expensive places to live. Except house prices in Norway are far lower for some reason.

 

it is nowhere near as simple as you make it sound. The cost of living in these two countries is the highest in the world but they are followed by Denmark, Belgium, Ireland, Netherlands and Sweden who are all part of the EU and are also above the UK in costs of living.

 

Switzerland and Norway have always been expensive places to live and both have special agreements with the EU on trade.

[LeMaquis]

And if HMG is deprived of powers by unelected Eurocrats, voting at General Elections is rendered meaningless.

Thus democracy is extinguished.

 

Unelected Eurocrats do not decide things in the EU, other than in the imagination of Mail and Sun readers. The power is in the hands of governments except in the Commission where agenda-setting powers are important. The governments of France and Germany have always been at the heart of EU development. Without their will things don't get done. The members of the Parliament and Councils are all elected directly by the electorate or as MPs and have far more power than some eurocrat in Brussels deciding on the weight of paper clips. Or are you admitting Nigel Farage is a waste of time?