abroadhead Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 I'm on a water meter at home, and noticed the last bill I had, the sewerage charge accounted for 90% of the bill. It's probably somewhere in that region if you think about it. BUT what if you were as far as possible completely 'green', and took the 1970's drought advice and 'bathed with a friend', and recycled washing up water in the garden, and collected rainwater instead of using hose pipes, only flushed when there was a No2...etc...etc Would you feel miffed at the 90% levy? I hasten to add. I'm not green, although being on a meter, we do tend to be a little more thoughtful. Rebates are possible, but worth doing! The standing charge for sewerage makes sense for the majority of water guzzlers, but the system is really not set up for people like you that want to be careful with water consumption, and we all ought to be headed in your direction with water in the future. There ought to be more incentive for people using recycled greywater - when you think about it, why on earth would you want to pay for tap water to flush your toilet? Tap water in Sheffield is treated to standards cleaner than any mineral water you could buy in the shops. The sewerage charge is also problematic because it doesn't do much to encourage modern sewer systems. I bet you are in a combined sewer area, which means that all your sewage gets mixed up with the local rainwater draining off the house and streets (which is relatively clean), and all the small springs and streams that were buried before development. You could track your toilet here for fun: http://flushtracker.com. SuDS (I hate the term, but it means Sustainable Drainage Systems) would help to resolve this by separating the sewers - you would pay less because only the sewage goes in the sewer to be cleaned at the Meadowhall sewage treatment works. All the cleanish rainwater would slowly infiltrate into the ground to restore groundwater, it would be treated naturally by the microbes on plant roots, and could form nice ponds and "street streams", serving also as traffic calming or just land value improvements. Here's an example mockup to give you the idea (http://pipedup.wordpress.com/2012/05/10/retrofitting-restoring-the-benefits-of-natural-drainage/); what would you think of restoring green space and street streams to some streets where they have space? I know a few places where local authority owned land has done this, justified by the cost saving from the water company sewerage charges (http://www.water21.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/Hydrological-Statement-Churchdown-Community-Pond-_Water21_Dec2010_v4.32.pdf). It is also possible to go one step further and treat your sewage (if you really want to be cool) in a constructed reedbed system, which could serve a street at a time (http://www.oceans-esu.com). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eater Sundae Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 Rebates are possible, but worth doing! The standing charge for sewerage makes sense for the majority of water guzzlers, but the system is really not set up for people like you that want to be careful with water consumption, and we all ought to be headed in your direction with water in the future. There ought to be more incentive for people using recycled greywater - when you think about it, why on earth would you want to pay for tap water to flush your toilet? Tap water in Sheffield is treated to standards cleaner than any mineral water you could buy in the shops. The sewerage charge is also problematic because it doesn't do much to encourage modern sewer systems. I bet you are in a combined sewer area, which means that all your sewage gets mixed up with the local rainwater draining off the house and streets (which is relatively clean), and all the small springs and streams that were buried before development. You could track your toilet here for fun: http://flushtracker.com. SuDS (I hate the term, but it means Sustainable Drainage Systems) would help to resolve this by separating the sewers - you would pay less because only the sewage goes in the sewer to be cleaned at the Meadowhall sewage treatment works. All the cleanish rainwater would slowly infiltrate into the ground to restore groundwater, it would be treated naturally by the microbes on plant roots, and could form nice ponds and "street streams", serving also as traffic calming or just land value improvements. Here's an example mockup to give you the idea (http://pipedup.wordpress.com/2012/05/10/retrofitting-restoring-the-benefits-of-natural-drainage/); what would you think of restoring green space and street streams to some streets where they have space? I know a few places where local authority owned land has done this, justified by the cost saving from the water company sewerage charges (http://www.water21.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/Hydrological-Statement-Churchdown-Community-Pond-_Water21_Dec2010_v4.32.pdf). It is also possible to go one step further and treat your sewage (if you really want to be cool) in a constructed reedbed system, which could serve a street at a time (http://www.oceans-esu.com). Re BIB. Anyone already on a water meter will make savings on their clean water by re-using grey water. I love the flushtracker. . Although you would need to be pretty... er... anal to use it more than once. I will show it to my 7 year old. She'll love to follow her poo down to Blackburn Meadows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abroadhead Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 Re BIB. Anyone already on a water meter will make savings on their clean water by re-using grey water. I love the flushtracker. . Although you would need to be pretty... er... anal to use it more than once. I will show it to my 7 year old. She'll love to follow her poo down to Blackburn Meadows. Is that actually the case that metered water users have greywater recycling? I would have thought this a separate thing, though people getting water meters might be interested in as part of the system. Ask her first if she knows where the toilet goes. I bet most kids don't get taught this sort of thing - yet when you think about it, it is one of the most fundemental pieces of infrastructure that humans have developed and it is why Sheffield's cholera monument is a monument and not an ongoing cemetary for waterbourne disease. You can tell I like sewers... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eater Sundae Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 Is that actually the case that metered water users have greywater recycling? I would have thought this a separate thing, though people getting water meters might be interested in as part of the system. Ask her first if she knows where the toilet goes. I bet most kids don't get taught this sort of thing - yet when you think about it, it is one of the most fundemental pieces of infrastructure that humans have developed and it is why Sheffield's cholera monument is a monument and not an ongoing cemetary for waterbourne disease. You can tell I like sewers... Sorry, I probably confused the issue. What I meant was that if someone re-used their greywater, say for flushing the toilet, then they would need less clean water through their meter, as they were no longer filling the toilet cistern with clean water. So their consumption would go down, and the metered cost would also. So, despite not getting any reduction in their sewerage costs, they would still make a saving through their clean water costs. My work relates to the industry, and so I probably take more of an interest in water treatment & supply and sewage treatment & disposal than "the man in the street". As I result, my daughter also probably knows more than most 7 year olds (whether she wants to or not). Including about Cholera. I know that some water treatment and sewage treatment works do have visitors centres (although I don't know if any of Sheffield's do), and I've seen parties of kids not much older than my daughter being taken around the Headingley Water Treatment Works in Leeds as part of a school visit. I think this is a good idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eater Sundae Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 Mine's being taken out of one provider's area into another..can that happen? I'm not sure. Does it actually say its going into a different area? Yorkshire Water's sewage treatment arm reaches a long way south. For example, both Barlow STW and Stockley STW (near junction 29 of the M1) come under YW's control. As does Old Whittington. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truman Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 I'm not sure. Does it actually say its going into a different area? Yorkshire Water's sewage treatment arm reaches a long way south. For example, both Barlow STW and Stockley STW (near junction 29 of the M1) come under YW's control. As does Old Whittington. I'm with ST right on it's boundary with YW..it's in YW territory now..obviously special forces it'll be interesting to see where it finishes.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eater Sundae Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 I'm not sure. Does it actually say its going into a different area? Yorkshire Water's sewage treatment arm reaches a long way south. For example, both Barlow STW and Stockley STW (near junction 29 of the M1) come under YW's control. As does Old Whittington. Adding a bit. I imagine it might depend on the local geography. If an area newr the Derbyshire border drains northward, it might be sensible to include it in YW's remit. I don't know how they decide, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eater Sundae Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 I'm with ST right on it's boundary with YW..it's in YW territory now..obviously special forces it'll be interesting to see where it finishes.. I'm pretty sure that the boundaries for Water Treatment and Wastewater Treatment ARE different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truman Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 I'm pretty sure that the boundaries for Water Treatment and Wastewater Treatment ARE different. But we only pay ST ..wonder if they send some cash on to YW? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeffrey Shaw Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 Off-topic posts re individuals' excreta have been deleted. Please confine this thread to its topic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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