medusa Posted August 11, 2012 Share Posted August 11, 2012 Missed the point completely as usual. And yes if pensioners get double dole money to live on then everyone should get that amount. No means testing, no medical involvement, no bureaucracy = cheaper benefits system, no more whinging, no more thousands of benefit fraudsters and the units paid to find them. Taxis only required for disabled folks? Jog on. Nobody likes the buses. They're not nice places. Doesn't stop even wheelchair users and blind people from using them. So you can't think of anything that people with disabilities might find more expensive? How about the fact that if you can't get up and about you feel the cold more easily and so need the heating on more? How about the people who cannot physically get onto a bus? What are they meant to do? How about having to buy equipment and bits of kit to help them do things in the house? Officially you can get help with the cost of them, but if you need them now (in August) but the local allocation for the year is already spent so you can't even be considered for the help to get the kit until next April? I'm not talking about posh coffee makers here BTW, I'm referring to equipment to help you get out of bed, to dress yourself or to get up and down stairs safely. It's clear that either you haven't thought this through fully, or you genuinely don't understand what is meant by the term 'disability', or you're being deliberately obtuse and trying to provoke an argument. Either way round, how about a bit of sensitivity? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juniee Posted August 11, 2012 Share Posted August 11, 2012 no sorry it is you that has missed the point and as i said before the dole money is not enough to live on I was only quoting one example regarding taxis what about things like incontince pads a wheechair will propel you to a bus stop but not everyone uses wheelchairs and do not be so silly i never said only disabled people use taxis always remember you could be in an accident tomorrow carers have to paid for people who clean your house for you due to disablity have to be paid or do you think that are free Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teddybare Posted August 11, 2012 Share Posted August 11, 2012 So you can't think of anything that people with disabilities might find more expensive? How about the fact that if you can't get up and about you feel the cold more easily and so need the heating on more? How about the people who cannot physically get onto a bus? What are they meant to do? How about having to buy equipment and bits of kit to help them do things in the house? Officially you can get help with the cost of them, but if you need them now (in August) but the local allocation for the year is already spent so you can't even be considered for the help to get the kit until next April? I'm not talking about posh coffee makers here BTW, I'm referring to equipment to help you get out of bed, to dress yourself or to get up and down stairs safely. It's clear that either you haven't thought this through fully, or you genuinely don't understand what is meant by the term 'disability', or you're being deliberately obtuse and trying to provoke an argument. Either way round, how about a bit of sensitivity? People who cannot physically get on a bus? But can physically get into a limosine or taxi in stead or the ones with zero mobility who required a mobility scooter? Or the ones who require two orderlies to carry them onto an ambulance to get about? Do they need more money for that? Increased heating costs affects everyone. Not an argument for giving extra money to one select group. If mobility equipment is only "officially" free but is not in practice that is a failing of the current system and not a reason to ignore it and hand out extra dole money. I understand very well the term "disabled" thankyou. I understand that as well as genuinely disabled people, it includes people who are morbidly obese, drunks, drug users, and people with varying levels of mental problems. I am not advocating stripping all benefits from disabled people, only making the benefits available to anyone the same amount. This thread would not exist if that was the case. And neither would scumbag companies like ATOS. It seems impossible to voice an opinion here without provoking an emotional response. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheff1johnny Posted August 11, 2012 Author Share Posted August 11, 2012 I am not advocating stripping all benefits from disabled people, only making the benefits available to anyone the same amount. This thread would not exist if that was the case. And neither would scumbag companies like ATOS. It seems impossible to voice an opinion here without provoking an emotional response. Well said about atos. Maybe disability needs reassassesing, but genuine cases are seeming to be the ones who are taking the blame. I have become demoralised, that atos has been awarded the contract to assess people for PIP. (the replacement for DLA) what was good about dla, it let people work, and it had separate categories for each individuals. Now atos scum will take all that away. I can no longer be bothered with them as a company, as no matter what they do wrong, the government rewards them with a more lucrative contract Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plain Talker Posted August 11, 2012 Share Posted August 11, 2012 People who cannot physically get on a bus? But can physically get into a limosine or taxi in stead or the ones with zero mobility who required a mobility scooter? Or the ones who require two orderlies to carry them onto an ambulance to get about? Do they need more money for that? Increased heating costs affects everyone. Not an argument for giving extra money to one select group. If mobility equipment is only "officially" free but is not in practice that is a failing of the current system and not a reason to ignore it and hand out extra dole money. I understand very well the term "disabled" thankyou. I understand that as well as genuinely disabled people, it includes people who are morbidly obese, drunks, drug users, and people with varying levels of mental problems. I am not advocating stripping all benefits from disabled people, only making the benefits available to anyone the same amount. This thread would not exist if that was the case. And neither would scumbag companies like ATOS. It seems impossible to voice an opinion here without provoking an emotional response. (my bold) Actually, you are proving by your comments that you are either:- a) only trolling for a response, or b) Genuinely have no idea about disabilities, particularly to separate mental illness from what you term "Genuine" disabilities. Your comment about heating also shows your utter lack of understanding. Some people with disabilities need extra heat just to be able to function. I know people who seize up if they get cold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheff1johnny Posted August 11, 2012 Author Share Posted August 11, 2012 If anyone feels strongly enough that disabled people are being treat unfairly, please tell atos staff: Here are some useful emails, and tell them what you think: Caroline Crouch Global PR Manager / United Kingdom Tel : +44 20 7830 4233 caroline.crouch@atos.net Anne de Beaumont Global PR Director / France Tel : +33 6 23 76 19 41 anne.debeaumont@atos.net José de Vries Global PR Manager / Benelux Tel : +31 6 30 27 26 11 jose.devries@atos.net Atos Global Public Relations Office Campus Atos 80, quai Voltaire 95887 Bezons cedex newsroom@atos.net Tel : +33 (0)1 73 26 00 00 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I1L2T3 Posted August 11, 2012 Share Posted August 11, 2012 If anyone feels strongly enough that disabled people are being treat unfairly, please tell atos staff: Here are some useful emails, and tell them what you think: Caroline Crouch Global PR Manager / United Kingdom Tel : +44 20 7830 4233 caroline.crouch@atos.net Anne de Beaumont Global PR Director / France Tel : +33 6 23 76 19 41 anne.debeaumont@atos.net José de Vries Global PR Manager / Benelux Tel : +31 6 30 27 26 11 jose.devries@atos.net Atos Global Public Relations Office Campus Atos 80, quai Voltaire 95887 Bezons cedex newsroom@atos.net Tel : +33 (0)1 73 26 00 00 Atos are only implementing what the government asks them to. This is one of those situations where outsourcing is great for the government - the outsourcer takes all the flak from the government. Contact your MPs as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I1L2T3 Posted August 11, 2012 Share Posted August 11, 2012 (my bold) Actually, you are proving by your comments that you are either:- a) only trolling for a response, or b) Genuinely have no idea about disabilities, particularly to separate mental illness from what you term "Genuine" disabilities. Your comment about heating also shows your utter lack of understanding. Some people with disabilities need extra heat just to be able to function. I know people who seize up if they get cold. Teddybare has no clue at all. Don't humour him/her by responding to the nonsense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juniee Posted August 11, 2012 Share Posted August 11, 2012 quite agree with you as one troll leaves another takes thier place so think i will ignore his comments as he is another one that lives in utopia just wish he would read things properly I have said twice that i do not think that the dole money is enough to live on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brin56 Posted August 11, 2012 Share Posted August 11, 2012 I share the view that “Workfare” as it appears is not a new concept but in fact a programme that was first developed and turned into a social programme in the state of Wisconsin (USA) and since then under the encouragement of institutions and legislative lobby groups in America that represent international corporate interests not only in America, but also in Canada, UK, Australia and several other countries. They were brought together in the 'Heritage Foundation' which influenced the emergence of the the Institute of Social Justice under Iain Duncan Smith to enact his reforms. The great gains of the programme were heralded across America as a Christian middle class American view and solution about their views on poverty, usually biased and based on stereotypes, that have been used along with powers that basically have in effect over ridden civil liberties and constitutional rights of its citizens. These policies cast welfare recipients as stereotypes of Chavs, *****, Tinkers, and Pikes as well as generous sprinkling of any other minorities, in much the same manner and lumped all the working class, the poor, the unemployed (however recent or not) together and the disabled and sick into one wide group. What I would like to point out is that the DWP itself commissioned a report that drew a comparative analysis between workfare in the USA, Canada, and Australia and its conclusions were broadly as follows:- 1. Dramatic reductions in welfare caseloads in the US and Canada cannot be attributed to workfare alone. 2. There is little evidence that workfare increases the likelihood of finding work. 3.Workfare is least effective for individuals with multiple barriers to work 4. Welfare recipients with multiple barriers often find it difficult to meet obligations to take part in unpaid work The scheme ignores the welfare recipients and essentially strips them of their pride and the care they should receive as citizens of a a country and side steps the issue that the only people who benefit out of ill thought policies are in fact businesses in the form of profits. This only discourages them from creating either new jobs or through a bolt of social conscience provide real living wages ~(Sources can be provided) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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