How much longer does Clegg have.

[Stoatwobbler]

Er, are you claiming that my post showed contempt? How so?

 

Not your post nessessarily, but yes, a lot of people on here have a lot of contempt for the worse off. And in the real world you do get judged on what part of town you come from, which is something I really don't like about Sheffield.

[truman]

Not your post nessessarily, but yes, a lot of people on here have a lot of contempt for the worse off. And in the real world you do get judged on what part of town you come from, which is something I really don't like about Sheffield.

 

I think that works both ways to be honest..

[alchresearch]

Lets face it, Clegg has a lot longer than the armchair experts of SF believe or wish.

[rossyrooney]

Lets face it, Clegg has a lot longer than the armchair experts of SF believe or wish.

 

I would imagine you're right,he has little opposition for his constituency,indeed it looks like the Tories have thrown in the towel locally.

 

But what,in your opinion will be left of the Lib Dems for him to lead after the next election.?

[I1L2T3]

Please give reasons for your answer; a mere assertion is insufficient.

 

Jeffrey you are just making assertions too.

 

We still have an upper class don't we. We still have an upper middle class. In both of those certain privileges and advantages (property, eduction, connections, assets) make the continuation of the class certain. These people, unless they have made poor business decisions, will tend not to struggle through a recession. Some of them work. Some of them don't.

 

Then we have a less steady middle class. They enjoy certain advantages too but life is less cetain. They have to work usually.

 

Then we have an aspiring middle class. My comment about the 90s is because this is where people who could fund a certain lifestyle (often largely based on debt) would position themselves. They enjoy(ed) a lifestyle that appeared to have the trappings of middle-class life but their position is often uncertain. Everything that they use to project their aspirations can be taken away in the blink of an eye. Even talent is not enough - to truly project the desired image can require the sacrifice of taking on crippling debts

 

Then there is the genuine blue-collar workers, the ones that don't spend their lives trying to pretend they're middle class.

 

Then we have an unfortunate underclass of people unemployed, underemployed or otherwise economically excluded.

 

Trying to break from one level to the next is tough. Society is stratified and as we repeatedly hear social mobility is at its lowest for decades.

 

It might not be the simple working/middle/upper class model of yesteryear but stratfification is built into our society, and it's not your simple two strata model either. To simplify it is to not understand the problems. If we don't understand the problems then we don't know how to fix them.

[I1L2T3]

So how do you define someone's class and why?

 

There's lots of ways to do it and loads of academic texts on it. Nobody ever agrees. It goes from simple workers/non-workers model to the traditional concept of working/middle/upper model to the ABCDE model, right through to highly complex classifications like Mosaic, Acorn which can have dozens of types

 

As for the why. From a government perspective to drive policy. Perhaps also from a commercial perspective too - marketing etc...

[donkey]

So how do you define someone's class and why?

 

Are you a visitor from another planet?

[truman]

Are you a visitor from another planet?

 

Not at all...what are your definitions?

[donkey]

Not at all...what are your definitions?

 

So how do you define someone's class and why?

 

 

 

For a start, social mobility has come to a stand still. One way of defining it would be to categorise one group as the people who have even greater economic and educational advantages than before as a result of the exclusion of the far larger group of people who are increasingly being left unable to compete on anything like a level playing field. This is a very crude categorisation as there are sub groups within these categories.

 

Although there are obviously grey areas and anomalies, class can generally be recognised by factors including clothes, area of residence, strength of accent, level of education and general demeanor. I wouldn't expect a working class person to greet me by telling me they are pleased to meet me and offering me a vol au vant, for example.

 

The main trick to having some level of awareness of the class structure - and the forces which keep it in place - is not being willfully blind deaf and dumb. I would put money that if a survey were done the majority of people who downplay the existence and impact of the class system come from the more economically advantaged end of it.

 

BTW, I too am from a working class background but was raised in a middle class environment because my dad is unusually brainy. Such anomalies do not disprove the existence of a class system. Quite the opposite, for two reasons.

 

1. By refering to having crossed a class boundary, you are already confirming the existence of different economic classes.

 

2. If my dad had been born into a middle or upper class household, he would have almost certainly got a lot further than he did economically and professionally.

[truman]

For a start, social mobility has come to a stand still. One way of defining it would be to categorise one group as the people who have even greater economic and educational advantages than before as a result of the exclusion of the far larger group of people who are increasingly being left unable to compete on anything like a level playing field. This is a very crude categorisation as there are sub groups within these categories.

 

Although there are obviously grey areas and anomalies, class can generally be recognised by factors including clothes, area of residence, strength of accent, level of education and general demeanor. I wouldn't expect a working class person to greet me by telling me they are pleased to meet me and offering me a vol au vant, for example.

 

The main trick to having some level of awareness of the class structure - and the forces which keep it in place - is not being willfully blind deaf and dumb. I would put money that if a survey were done the majority of people who downplay the existence and impact of the class system come from the more economically advantaged end of it.

 

BTW, I too am from a working class background but was raised in a middle class environment because my dad is unusually brainy. Such anomalies do not disprove the existence of a class system. Quite the opposite, for two reasons.

 

1. By refering to having crossed a class boundary, you are already confirming the existence of different economic classes.

 

2. If my dad had been born into a middle or upper class household, he would have almost certainly got a lot further than he did economically and professionally.

 

Where did I do that? I wasn't aware that I'd said what class I thought I was..I was just after finding out what people thought class was eg money,job etc and where the lines they drew were.