caparo Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 (edited) Errrr..No, I havn't been hung up on measures to deter them. I have merely responded to others on the subject! Yes I would welcome measures to distinguish fakes from real. Will I need a microchip reader? Or would I just have to take the shopkeepers word that they are genuine? I wondered when someone would suggest I give up smoking!!!!!...That's not the point! No you won't need a microchip reader. Not unless you buy you cigs from a bloke in the gents toilet down your local pub, and I presume even you realise that having a chip reader there would be a waste of time. Your goods are scanned by the supermarket where you buy them. Their display is triggered by the chip and tells you what you are buying. If there isn't a chip it doesn't display. Perfectly simple to anyone who desires to understand the system. As a smoker I would have thought paying 5p was a small price to pay for knowing that what you about to inhale is only highly poisonous and not lethal. Giving up smoking is precisely the point. Measures are being taken constantly to make smokers lives more expensive and less convenient. The costs are being increased to convince folks that continuing smoking isn't worthwhile. It's just some are slower on the uptake than others. Edited August 17, 2012 by caparo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alchresearch Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 There's no need for expensive microchips, there are plenty of other anti-tamper seals which are cheap enough to be used and can't be easily copied. The point is to make the counterfeiting measures to just a point where it's not worth the counterfeiter's time and effort. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteMorris Posted August 17, 2012 Author Share Posted August 17, 2012 Not necessarily added to the price..if the chip stops counterfeiters then the tobacco company will sell more...covering the extra cost of the chip...how is prohibition the same as plain packaging? If cigs. were banned then maybe you'd have a point.... The problem is similar to the issue of prohibition. Lets face it, non smokers would be quite happy to completely ban ciggies! Prohibition made alchol illegal, therefore criminal elements and bootleggers thrived and so did the violence associated with the gangs. Cigarettes are already an under the counter product. The plain packaging is just another step along that road. It's a charter for counterfeiters! Do you go on or have ever been on a foreign holiday and brought back some duty free stuff (booze or whatever)? The idea being that you don't want to pay the 'duty' they charge on those products in this country. That's precisely why the underworld will see this as another golden opportunity to seize more the the already huge market share! On your first point of the chip enabling the tobacco companies to sell more. I don't see that. It's not the tobacco companies that are taking most of the revenue from sales of cigs, it's the government! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteMorris Posted August 17, 2012 Author Share Posted August 17, 2012 No you won't need a microchip reader. Not unless you buy you cigs from a bloke in the gents toilet down your local pub, and I presume even you realise that having a chip reader there would be a waste of time. Your goods are scanned by the supermarket where you buy them. Their display is triggered by the chip and tells you what you are buying. If there isn't a chip it doesn't display. Perfectly simple to anyone who desires to understand the system. As a smoker I would have thought paying 5p was a small price to pay for knowing that what you about to inhale is only highly poisonous and not lethal. Giving up smoking is precisely the point. Measures are being taken constantly to make smokers lives more expensive and less convenient. The costs are being increased to convince folks that continuing smoking isn't worthwhile. It's just some are slower on the uptake than others. I really don't need your veiled insults thank you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truman Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 The problem is similar to the issue of prohibition. Lets face it, non smokers would be quite happy to completely ban ciggies!Prohibition made alchol illegal, therefore criminal elements and bootleggers thrived and so did the violence associated with the gangs. Cigarettes are already an under the counter product. The plain packaging is just another step along that road. It's a charter for counterfeiters! Do you go on or have ever been on a foreign holiday and brought back some duty free stuff (booze or whatever)? The idea being that you don't want to pay the 'duty' they charge on those products in this country. That's precisely why the underworld will see this as another golden opportunity to seize more the the already huge market share! On your first point of the chip enabling the tobacco companies to sell more. I don't see that. It's not the tobacco companies that are taking most of the revenue from sales of cigs, it's the government! The way I see it.. If we follow the Australian example the packages aren't plain..and there are different "designs" If counterfeiters can do good copies now then I don't see how the "plain" packets make it easier Are you saying that if there are fewer counterfeit cigs ('cos of the chip) then the cig companies won't sell more? How does that work?Will people smoke less? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caparo Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 I really don't need your veiled insults thank you! You've lost the argument I see. :hihi: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caparo Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 You would think there were enough incentives not to buy contraband fags. http://www.asiaone.com/Health/News/Story/A1Story20090112-114150.html If you have smoked contraband cigarettes, chances are you have sucked in a whole lot of disgusting stuff, including human faeces. Such cheap smokes, bought off peddlers, have been found to contain 'extra ingredients' which also include dead flies and insect eggs. One in five contraband cigarettes is likely to be a fake, made with various materials other than tobacco, said trade investigators with the International Chamber of Commerce's Counterfeit Intelligence Bureau (CIB). Much of it can be harmful. The CIB report found that 'fake smokes can contain five times the level of cadmium, six times as much lead, 160 per cent more tar and 133 per cent more carbon monoxide'. The report also found sand, wood and mould in fake cigarettes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteMorris Posted August 17, 2012 Author Share Posted August 17, 2012 There's no need for expensive microchips, there are plenty of other anti-tamper seals which are cheap enough to be used and can't be easily copied. The point is to make the counterfeiting measures to just a point where it's not worth the counterfeiter's time and effort. But it's already demonstrably worthwhile for them! Plain packaging will just make it easier, and more lucrative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truman Posted August 17, 2012 Share Posted August 17, 2012 But it's already demonstrably worthwhile for them! Plain packaging will just make it easier, and more lucrative. It won't make it easier....we're just going round in circles here.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteMorris Posted August 17, 2012 Author Share Posted August 17, 2012 You've lost the argument I see. :hihi: I didn't realise there was an 'argument'...I thought it was a discussion, sorry if I misunderstood. I'm afraid anyone who resorts to insults, veiled or otherwise, has lost an argument! I just won't respond to you further! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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