Hillsborough document release

[ANGELFIRE1]

I see Bettison has fallen on his sword and gone.

 

Angel.

[tingle165]

Did all the fans outside have tickets???

[tingle165]

Not having a dig at Liverpool fans in particular we all know there are always a minority of fans that spoil things for everyone, such as Friday night for example

[mikem8634]

Did all the fans outside have tickets???

 

The vast majority - I imagine that a handful didn't but ever since the Taylor Report in 1990 it has been proven and accepted that ticketless fans did not contribute to the disaster.

 

The Panel has quite simply found "no evidence" in support of allegations of "exceptional levels of drunkenness, ticketlessness or violence among Liverpool fans", "no evidence that fans had conspired to arrive late at the stadium" and "no evidence that they stole from the dead and dying."

11.01 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j6c3gvAoqnM

 

Have you bothered to read post 1006?

[tingle165]

Yes i did "no evidence" but ground was rammed yet hundreds still outside

[mikem8634]

Yes i did "no evidence" but ground was rammed yet hundreds still outside

 

Well, as you have read post 1006 you will see links that provide further clarification related to the answers you require. Things like -

 

15 April 1989

The circumstances

1.77 Consistent with the Operational Order, many spectators arriving in Sheffield on trains and coaches were escorted by the police from their point of arrival to the stadium. As they approached the stadium there was no filtering of the crowd and the bottleneck at the concourse in front of the turnstiles became tightly packed. With walls, fences or gates to the sides and front of this small area, the only relief was to move backwards. Many more fans arrived, oblivious to the mounting crush at the front, and the situation in the vicinity of the turnstiles soon became critical.

 

1.78 As kick-off time approached, the crush worsened, and men, women, children and police officers struggled to breathe. Mounted police officers were trapped in the crowd. In later testimonies police officers stated that the crowd grew ‘unruly’, ‘nasty’ and ‘violent’, but people caught in the crush gave a contrasting account. They felt there had been no attempt to manage the crowd, no filtering and no queuing.

 

1.79 The Police Control Box, the centre of the policing operation at the stadium, was positioned inside the ground, elevated above the Leppings Lane terrace, giving a commanding view of the pens below. At 2.30pm the bank of CCTV monitors in the box showed the build-up of fans in Leppings Lane and at the turnstiles.

 

1.80 As the crush became critical, C/Supt Duckenfield faced a serious dilemma. The senior officer outside the ground, Superintendent Roger Marshall, radioed that unless the large exit gates were opened to relieve the crush there would be serious injuries, possibly deaths. Hesitating, C/Supt Duckenfield gave the command to open the gates.

 

1.81 Gate C was adjacent to the turnstiles and once opened the crowd walked through into the inner concourse behind the Leppings Lane terrace and the North Stand. Fans recalled ‘hanging back’ to wait for the congestion to ease. When Gate C opened they walked onto the inner concourse and down the tunnel.

 

1.82 The tunnel was directly opposite Gate C and the sign above read: STANDING. The gates at the head of the tunnel were fastened back against the wall. Oblivious to the layout of the terrace, and unable to view the terrace from the tunnel entrance, more than 2,000 fans descended into the already packed central pens.

 

1.83 When they arrived at the bottom of the tunnel the central fence forced them left into pen 4 or right into pen 3. There were no stewards at either end of the tunnel. The central pens soon held twice their capacity. There was no respite to the sides or front and the sheer volume ofpeople prevented escape back up the tunnel.

 

1.84 As the teams ran onto the pitch for the 3pm kick-off, the crowd cheered but already in the central pens people were screaming. Others fell silent, already unconscious. Survivors described being gradually compressed, unable to move, their heads ‘locked between arms and shoulders ... faces gasping in panic’. They were aware that people were dying and they were helpless to save themselves.

 

1.85 In pen 3 the pressure became so severe that the faces of fans at the front were pressed into the perimeter fencing, distorted by the mesh. As fans lost consciousness some slipped to the ground under the feet of others unable to move. Survivors recall the gradual compression on their chests preventing them from breathing.

 

1.86 Fans screamed at the police on the perimeter track to open the small gate in each pen onto the pitch, ‘but they just seemed transfixed. They did nothing’. As fans tried to climb the overhanging perimeter fence, officers on the track pushed them back into the crowd.

 

1.87 In the Police Control Box, C/Supt Duckenfield and his colleagues had a clear view of the packed central pens and the underpopulated side pens. Having opened the exit gate, he had failed to order the closure of the tunnel. He stated later that he had confidence that officers ‘were patrolling the concourse area’ and acting ‘on their own initiative ... would have taken some action in the tunnel’.

 

1.88 From the Police Control Box he watched fans trying to climb from the pens. Subsequently he reflected that it did not occur to him that they were trying to escape a crush. Then he saw a perimeter gate open, apparently without authority. ‘My perception is [sic] … it was a pitch invasion’. 1.89 This was the message transmitted to officers throughout the stadium as they rushed to the Leppings Lane perimeter track. They assumed they were dealing with crowd disorder and a pitch invasion rather than severe crushing. Initially, they responded accordingly.

 

The complete answer as far as we currently know it can be found here http://hillsborough.independent.gov.uk/

[mikem8634]

Let me help out here:

http://hillsborough.independent.gov.uk/repository/media/VID0002.html

around the 8 min mark onwards for those of you who are impatient

 

It's interesting to watch those who are climbing the outer fences. They're not entering the ground, they're looking about, many of them searching (presumably for lost friends and family), and some clearly trying to just see inside the turnstiles to see what the hold up is, as well as some just relieved to be out of the bedlam below

 

I haven't had time to watch it all yet. I'll do so later

 

The fans 'running' through gate C are pushed through by the sheer weight of the crowd behind them, but mostly stop and regroup with friends before continuing without running

 

 

 

An excellent post that further clarifies what actually happened on the concourse outside the turnstiles. Post 970 - 2 pages ago.

 

Watch the footage in full and listen to the commentary. It will please a certain type of poster as you get to see one or two Liverpool fans being angry. What you also get is an explanation of what actually happened, in context. So you see the chaos of the crush, you see some fans running through a gate, you see some fans climbing over a wall - all things that have been used to paint a negative picture - but you also find out WHY.

[Jeffrey Shaw]

Wasn't Lester Piggott stripped of his Knighthood?

Wasn't Lester Piggott convicted of criminal offences (tax evasion)?

[mikem8634]

Wasn't Lester Piggott convicted of criminal offences (tax evasion)?

 

Yes and Bettison could be charged and convicted for conspiracy to pervert the course of justice.

[Jeffrey Shaw]

With whom did he conspire?