boyfriday Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 My biggest worry is that its becoming more common - same neck of the woods, just a few months ago: http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2012/jul/26/kiaran-stapleton-anuj-bidve-killer Kiaran Stapleton 'has no real feeling for what he has done' It was even claimed that James Bulgers killers got a better life in prison than they did at home - warm place to sleep, clean clothes and hot meals. When prison is better than the life they have, that's not a good reflection on society or punishment. But I reckon these are individuals with particularly special qualities..I bet placed under analysis they're all narcissists or sociopaths. There's also the macho temptation to act out the game that prison isn't effective, they 'enjoy it' and 'don't mind it all', if that were the case I wonder why so many go to such great lengths to avoid incarceration, even Cregan in an attempt to avoid detection is reported to have found a garden shed at the back of a pub preferable to a bed in a cell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krooner Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 I just wonder what the 'alleged' purpotrator was doing out on 'bail'. Apparently he was arrested some 3 months prior to this, suspected of shooting someone in a pub! What on earth was someone thinking when they gave him bail for such a serious crime? My opinion, is that something that serious warrants the 'suspect' locked up until such time as the investigation rules them out, or they are formally charged. Someones decision to let him out on bail, put not only the lives of those poor policewomen who walked into a trap at risk, but every other member of the public too. I couldn't agree more, PM. Im sure such rules and regulations are drawn up by the likes of someone who views the rest of us as mere beasts of the field. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteMorris Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 I couldn't agree more, PM. Im sure such rules and regulations are drawn up by the likes of someone who views the rest of us as mere beasts of the field. I'm staggered that he was given bail. I'm also quite surprised that someone in authority hasn't mentioned it, or the media come to that (not that I've seen anyway). I know it's a dark time for the Manchester Police at the moment, and I have every sympathy for the families and work colleagues of those 2 unfortunate bobbies. But surely at some point, someone has to raise the question. What was he doing out on bail???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteMorris Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 He was given bail because there wasn't enough evidence to charge him with an offence at the time, so he was questioned and released. I don't think anyone can be blamed for that and you can imagine the prison population would soar if everyone questioned in connection with a serious criminal offence was jailed until such time as someone else was charged, it would also be vastly unfair to a lot of very innocent people. I'm sorry, I don't agree with you on this issue. For a crime of murder, I don't think it's fair on the public for this person to be allowed to walk free and put members of the public at large in danger (including those coppers). Ok, I accept that it would be unfair to a percentage of people who were locked up and subsequently proved to be innocent. Rather that than have someone on the streets who 'has' committed murder and knows when he's finally brought to justice he's not gonna see freedom perhaps ever again, and therefore has nothing to lose by shooting two coppers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mort Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 Back on topic please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteMorris Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 Back on topic please. I'm happy to leave that tangent alone! I was merely responing to others! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyfriday Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 I'm sorry, I don't agree with you on this issue. For a crime of murder, I don't think it's fair on the public for this person to be allowed to walk free and put members of the public at large in danger (including those coppers). Ok, I accept that it would be unfair to a percentage of people who were locked up and subsequently proved to be innocent. Rather that than have someone on the streets who 'has' committed murder and knows when he's finally brought to justice he's not gonna see freedom perhaps ever again, and therefore has nothing to lose by shooting two coppers! Generally when someone's charged with a murder or rape offence there is no presumption of bail, the defence have to argue why it would be appropriate in individual circumstances, whereas in other less serious offences the prosecution have to argue why the defendant shouldn't get it. Cregan had only been questioned in connection with the murders and at the time the police had no/little evidence on which to prepare a charge..in other words they didn't know he was guilty of the crime they were investigating, so he walked and subsequently absconded. Obviously with the benefit of hindsight it's shame he wasnt charged and kept locked up but I don't believe it represents a failure of the system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyfriday Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 Back on topic please. Point taken mort, I didn't see your post until I'd posted Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harmston Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 Its time we had a amnesty on guns and knives, after that any one with a gun or knive should have a 5 yr jail sentence, if it has been used against a person as a threat a further time added, and if injuries are sustained a still further time added, if used against a police officer a life time should be given The only person to my way of thinking who needs a gun are Farmers for vermin control., Before the sport gun people start, they should belong to a gun club and all weapons held in a club secure premises under strict supervision This would let us keep the present set up of the police having a A.R.Unit and having to arm all police being armed ( I wonder what the cost of arming the police would be ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halibut Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 Its time we had a amnesty on guns and knives, after that any one with a gun or knive should have a 5 yr jail sentence, if it has been used against a person as a threat a further time added, and if injuries are sustained a still further time added, if used against a police officer a life time should be given The only person to my way of thinking who needs a gun are Farmers for vermin control., Before the sport gun people start, they should belong to a gun club and all weapons held in a club secure premises under strict supervision This would let us keep the present set up of the police having a A.R.Unit and having to arm all police being armed ( I wonder what the cost of arming the police would be ) I know what it would be; more people dying from gunshot wounds. Not worth it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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