'They gave their lives'

[discodown]

There are two forces at play here with the use of language in this scenario.

 

Firstly the media is trying to be emotive in a couple of ways. They want to be sensitive to any friends, family or colleagues of the dead and not be blunt about them being dead. Also they want to make it seem like the officers made a sacrifice or in some way did choose and were noble or heroic when in fact they didn't actually have a choice at all. It was a horrible sordid business and they were shot like rabid dogs in the street in cold blood. But that doesn't wash well. We have to admire them and make them heroes.

 

Secondly we are hopeless at dealing with death in any capacity. Don't believe me? Take a walk around any cemetery and look at the gravestones, See how many people were "taken from us" or "went to sleep" or have "gone to the angels" or are "at rest" or are doing anything in fact except decomposing quietly underground. Its incredibly confusing. People die, its a fact of life yet we are so scared of our own mortality even in the boneyard we won't even say it on their markers. How strange and sad

[Kerrangaroo]

There are two forces at play here with the use of language in this scenario.

 

Firstly the media is trying to be emotive in a couple of ways. They want to be sensitive to any friends, family or colleagues of the dead and not be blunt about them being dead. Also they want to make it seem like the officers made a sacrifice or in some way did choose and were noble or heroic when in fact they didn't actually have a choice at all. It was a horrible sordid business and they were shot like rabid dogs in the street in cold blood. But that doesn't wash well. We have to admire them and make them heroes.

 

Secondly we are hopeless at dealing with death in any capacity. Don't believe me? Take a walk around any cemetery and look at the gravestones, See how many people were "taken from us" or "went to sleep" or have "gone to the angels" or are "at rest" or are doing anything in fact except decomposing quietly underground. Its incredibly confusing. People die, its a fact of life yet we are so scared of our own mortality even in the boneyard we won't even say it on their markers. How strange and sad

 

Equally when we write the epitaphs on headstones we probably aim to retain the sadness we feel. The words are the emotion we felt at the time.

I don't see it as having a fear of mortality. Are there not also restrictions as to what we can have or have things altered now?

[Conrod]

I think its not really the time to be discussing such trivialities in such a serious matter

Indeed, a totally unnecessary and inappropriate thread.

[Halibut]

Indeed, a totally unnecessary and inappropriate thread.

 

In what way is it innapropriate to discuss the use of language?

 

(I'll ignore the bit about unnecessary - no thread is ever 'necessary')

[Mister M]

Indeed, a totally unnecessary and inappropriate thread.

 

No I don't think it is. How language is used especially by officialdom and the establishment can be revealing and often determines how we are conditioned to think about issues. Just look at the media response in the aftermath of Hillsborough 20 years go, and how so many people were encouraged to blame the fans, when in fact a smear campaign was being conducted.

I can't think of a more relevant thread.

[skinz]

Indeed, a totally unnecessary and inappropriate thread.

 

You mean you dislike Halibut. Say what you mean, mean what you say.

 

 

 

If those two officers were given a choice to "give" their lives so as to somehow comfort the masses they would not be dead now. "Give", "taken" are sentimentalities conjured by the church, establishment and papers who indirectly nurture this idea collectively that somehow death is honorable. Quite simply it isn't, the masses buy it though.

[Phanerothyme]

Interesting discussion, and interesting that NLP was mentioned above. I don't hold neuro-linguistic programming in very high regard, but one of the tenets of the system is undeniable, language is hypnotism.

 

But I think in this case, rather than being a deliberate attempt to impose a nuanced version of events through the skillful use of language, it's more a case of lazy journos failing to see past the cliches and well worn colocations of their trade. As usual.

[Rupert_Baehr]

It struck me last night whilst watching a news report about the killing of the two police constables in Manchester...the expression was that they 'gave their lives' for their job.

It made me quite cross actually. To say that they 'gave their lives' implies a degree of choice and free will that simply didn't exist.

 

They didn't give their lives. They were stolen away from them.

What do you think?

 

I think its not really the time to be discussing such trivialities in such a serious matter

 

Indeed, a totally unnecessary and inappropriate thread.

 

I'm not so sure. There are jobs where - when you take the job - you know you may well have to give your life to do it.

 

Perhaps some people - because often the people who take on those jobs are rather young when they do so - do not consider the implications in depth .. not the sort of depth that an older person might be able to comprehend.

 

Even so, not very many quit the job because of the risk, so (IMO) it's reasonable to assume that they continued to do the job knowing that they might have to give their lives.

 

In this case, two public servants (policemen) [and I use the word in the OE/OHG meaning, ''people''] gave their lives to support the community.

 

The ''degree of choice'' - is there. They made the choice when they took the job and they confirmed that choice each day that they put on their uniforms and went to work.

 

The risk might be small - but it''s hardly insignificant. They accepted that risk and they died as a result.

 

They died serving society.

 

I think they were heroines.

[AWOL]

I'm not so sure. There are jobs where - when you take the job - you know you may well have to give your life to do it.

 

Perhaps some people - because often the people who take on those jobs are rather young when they do so - do not consider the implications in depth .. not the sort of depth that an older person might be able to comprehend.

 

Even so, not very many quit the job because of the risk, so (IMO) it's reasonable to assume that they continued to do the job knowing that they might have to give their lives.

 

In this case, two public servants (policemen) [and I use the word in the OE/OHG meaning, ''people''] gave their lives to support the community.

 

The ''degree of choice'' - is there. They made the choice when they took the job and they confirmed that choice each day that they put on their uniforms and went to work.

 

The risk might be small - but it''s hardly insignificant. They accepted that risk and they died as a result.

 

They died serving society.

 

I think they were heroines.

 

 

They were indeed heroines who gave their lives for their job. As you rightly say, they were aware of the risks.

[Aleksandr]

Their lives were taken from them.

No "giving" involved in my book.

Expanding Waldo's excellent post (#9), they didn't have their lives taken from them, they were destroyed. They were their lives, and now they are dead. Stating that they had their lives taken from them implies that they still exist, perhaps in some spiritual sense, which they do not as there is no spiritual sense.