Tory Chief Whip 'Plebgate' Thread

[I1L2T3]

No He denied using the words the police attributed to him, but I'll leave you to delude yourself. I'm off out to the pub.

 

This is how unblinkered folks see events.

 

http://www.channel4.com/news/andrew-mitchell-plebgate-police-cctv-downing-street

 

I think Mitchell could have been clearer with his description of the event much earlier. On 20th September he said this:

 

“I was told that I was not allowed to leave that way. While I do not accept that I used the words that have been reported, I accept I did not treat the police with the respect they deserve. "

 

A couple of days later he clearly admitted to swearing. He could have been clearer initially.

 

 

I would say one last thing about all this and that is I sincerely hope both sides one day get to fairly provide their side of the story in a court of law. Then we can all know the truth.

 

Until then it's a classic case of one person's word against others, the truth as things stand impossible to know because none of us were there. In the meantime we all have the privilege of making up our own minds who we beleive most. Ultimately we are faced with the sad truth that one side or the other is most likely lying when both sides should be beyond criticism (if both had been acting in the way expected that night).

Edited February 6, 2013 by I1L2T3

[Riannon]

I suppose one or two in the crowd at Hillsborough swore when they were being maltreated by obstructive police. If as appears likely this was a consipracy to bring down a minister it is hardly surprising he swore if confronted by deliberately obstructive officers.

I note that several police officers have been arrested already and others suspended under notification of investigation into their conduct.

The frightening aspect of this is as pointed out it is one man's word against another. However when one party deliberately sets out to entrap the other and conspire with others to confirm the lies it goes rather beyond that.

Two facts are beyond dispute, and that is that a serving police officer deliberately submitted false evidence to back up other officers stories, and contrary to police regulations and the official secrets act someone in the police leaked confidential reports to the media to big up what really was a non story.

[I1L2T3]

I suppose one or two in the crowd at Hillsborough swore when they were being maltreated by obstructive police. If as appears likely this was a consipracy to bring down a minister it is hardly surprising he swore if confronted by deliberately obstructive officers.

I note that several police officers have been arrested already and others suspended under notification of investigation into their conduct.

The frightening aspect of this is as pointed out it is one man's word against another. However when one party deliberately sets out to entrap the other and conspire with others to confirm the lies it goes rather beyond that.

Two facts are beyond dispute, and that is that a serving police officer deliberately submitted false evidence to back up other officers stories, and contrary to police regulations and the official secrets act someone in the police leaked confidential reports to the media to big up what really was a non story.

 

I'm not sure the poice deliberately set out with a plan from the start that was designed to create a conspiracy against Mitchell that with the planned trigger a refusal to open a gate. It looks like it could have quickly spiralled into a conspiracy from the incident though. We'll have to wait and see.

 

Like I said I hope the truth comes out.

[Obelix]

I did mention 'given subsequent events' in my post.

 

Looking at the footage I can see 8 people. Two police inside the gate. Two (I presume security or police staff just outside), one person who clearly stops to look inside the gates as the incident happens, two who walk past and glance towards the incident, and Mitchell himself. Maybe the police could claim that in the heat of the moment they recorded the incident as best they could. They had after all had a highly unusual altercation with a senior member of the government who had then promised to follow things up (again admitted as far as I know by Mitchell). An unsettling experience I expect. Can you prove it was a deliberate lie?

 

If we are employing police who are as unsettled as that in a minor exchange of words, well let's say that they shouldnt be guarding Downing Street.

 

The police claimed that there were members of the public - as you said...

 

The police are well within their rights even now to haul him in and caution him. What he said was witnessed by three officers and there are witnesses from the general public too.

 

So where are these people? They dont appear to be on the CCTV....

[I1L2T3]

If we are employing police who are as unsettled as that in a minor exchange of words, well let's say that they shouldnt be guarding Downing Street.

 

The police claimed that there were members of the public - as you said...

 

 

 

So where are these people? They dont appear to be on the CCTV....

 

If you believe Mitchell it was a minor exhange of words. If you believe the police it was much more serious. If you believe Mitchell's firends he apparently "lost it" a bit. It wasn't a usual situation that is for sure - Mitchell was carpeted in the commons for it by Cameron too.

 

As stated earlier the CCTV shows 8 people in the vicinity of the incident, including Mitchell. Three members of the public. Two police inside the main gates. Two police or security staff inside the outer gate. I would like to know if they have been identified and interviewed. One member of the public in particular (clearly stops to take an interest in what is happening) could be critical to clearing Mitchell.

[Anna Glypta]

If you believe Mitchell it was a minor exhange of words. If you believe the police it was much more serious. If you believe Mitchell's firends he apparently "lost it" a bit. It wasn't a usual situation that is for sure - Mitchell was carpeted in the commons for it by Cameron too.

 

As stated earlier the CCTV shows 8 people in the vicinity of the incident, including Mitchell. Three members of the public. Two police inside the main gates. Two police or security staff inside the outer gate. I would like to know if they have been identified and interviewed. One member of the public in particular (clearly stops to take an interest in what is happening) could be critical to clearing Mitchell.

 

What have Mitchell's "friends" got to do with it. You seem to be jumping on this bandwagon of inventing witnesses who weren't actually there. That's the police's job.

[Uptowngirl]

It seems another one is about to bite the dust.

 

http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/uk/crime/article3695747.ece

 

 

 

A police officer central to the “Plebgate” affair is being investigated for misconduct after allegedly misrepresenting a meeting with Andrew Mitchell.

 

West Mercia police is investigating Ken Mackaill, chairman of the force’s Police Federation branch, because a tape contradicts his account of what Mr Mitchell, who quit as Chief Whip in October, said in the meeting.

 

They acted after a tape of the meeting raised questions about Mr Mackaill’s integrity by contradicting his public account of the conversation.

Edited February 23, 2013 by Uptowngirl

[Anna Glypta]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2460912/Plebgate-police-officers-threaten-public-trust-police-Theresa-May-warns.html

 

Public trust in the police is under threat after officers tried to stitch-up a Cabinet minister, the Home Secretary warned today.

 

In a dramatic intervention in the row with police,Theresa May demanded an apology from officers accused of misrepresenting Andrew Mitchell after a crunch meeting in the wake of the ‘plebgate’ row which forced his resignation.

 

Mrs May said a report by the Independent Police Complaints Commission which said the officers’ behaviour after the meeting ‘raised issue of honesty and integrity’ made for 'troubling reading'.

 

The latest row centres on a high-profile meeting in October last year between Mr Mitchell and the Police Federation seen as a last-ditch chance to save his job.

 

It followed claims he called officers guarding Downing Street ‘plebs’ when they refused to let him ride his bicycle through the main gates – something he has strongly denied.

 

Inspector Ken MacKaill, Detective Sergeant Stuart Hinton and Sergeant Chris Jones were accused of deliberately misrepresenting what Mr Mitchell said in a meeting at his Sutton Coldfield constituency office held in the wake of the so-called ‘plebgate’ affair.

 

Mr Mitchell made clear to the officers exactly what he said during the altercation, but Mr MacKaill told journalists after the meeting that the senior was 'continuing to refuse to elaborate on what happened'.

 

 

Unfortunately for the police officers Mitchel had recorded the meeting and played the tape to journalists proving the Federations comments were false. With 8 people so far arrested and on bail it seems those on the forum who were so quick to condemn Andrew Mitchel may have acted in haste.

Edited October 15, 2013 by Anna Glypta

[Bypassblade]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2460912/Plebgate-police-officers-threaten-public-trust-police-Theresa-May-warns.html

 

Public trust in the police is under threat after officers tried to stitch-up a Cabinet minister, the Home Secretary warned today.

 

In a dramatic intervention in the row with police,Theresa May demanded an apology from officers accused of misrepresenting Andrew Mitchell after a crunch meeting in the wake of the ‘plebgate’ row which forced his resignation.

 

Mrs May said a report by the Independent Police Complaints Commission which said the officers’ behaviour after the meeting ‘raised issue of honesty and integrity’ made for 'troubling reading'.

 

The latest row centres on a high-profile meeting in October last year between Mr Mitchell and the Police Federation seen as a last-ditch chance to save his job.

 

It followed claims he called officers guarding Downing Street ‘plebs’ when they refused to let him ride his bicycle through the main gates – something he has strongly denied.

 

Inspector Ken MacKaill, Detective Sergeant Stuart Hinton and Sergeant Chris Jones were accused of deliberately misrepresenting what Mr Mitchell said in a meeting at his Sutton Coldfield constituency office held in the wake of the so-called ‘plebgate’ affair.

 

Mr Mitchell made clear to the officers exactly what he said during the altercation, but Mr MacKaill told journalists after the meeting that the senior was 'continuing to refuse to elaborate on what happened'.

 

 

Unfortunately for Federation Mitchel had recorded the meeting and played the tape to journalists proving the Federations comments were false. With 8 people so far arrested and on bail it seems those on the forum who were so quick to condemn Andrew Mitchel may have acted in haste.

 

To be fair Anna, it was not just on here, he was ripped to pieces by the news & press:)

[alternageek]

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