six45ive Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 There's a very good way to avoid confusion i.e. Man up and face the undeniable fact that, in this world, in our society, there are two differing definitions of the word 'atheist', and, when using the term, simply make clear which of the 2 you're using. Especially when trying to communicate with the general public, who, in the main, are using the different one to most sceptics, or, are not even aware the 2 are different. That's only, of course, if, as a sceptic, you're genuinely interested in clear, productive communication. If, in contrast, you don't give a hoot about communication, or, don't care that confusion reigns, or, are just some kind of 'word nazi' elitist, who thinks etymology trumps common usage of a word, then, carry on ............. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
six45ive Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 OK- what would count as evidence for you? Er........data would be a good start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onewheeldave Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 The trouble with that is this; -"Atheist" meaning someone without belief also covers the many other labels (ie, an anti-theist/humanist/apatheist/atheist 2.0's are all atheists in this sense) -"Atheist" meaning someone who believes there is no God... well where does that leave someone who is simply without belief in God? What category do they fit into? Strictly speaking 'atheist' as in 'without belief', does not cover 'atheism' as in 'believes there's no God', as the 2nd makes a claim that the first doesn't. As to which category each fits into- it's just a case of being aware of the differences and making it clear which you're using. Just one of many options to deal with this long-standing, well-recognised issue- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Negative_and_positive_atheism Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onewheeldave Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 Er........data would be a good start. Would a few links to online dictionaries that use the 2nd definition do? Would a poll on this forum count at all? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marx Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 Ohhhh no!.... Karl has made an appearence http://conservapedia.com/Militant_atheism I'm out of here. Your faith is cracking. You are beginning to see the absurdity of religion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RootsBooster Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 Strictly speaking 'atheist' as in 'without belief', does not cover 'atheism' as in 'believes there's no God', as the 2nd makes a claim that the first doesn't. Of course it does, if you believe there is no God, then you have no belief in God, by default. If you have no belief in God, it doesn't mean that you believe there is no God. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RootsBooster Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 Would a few links to online dictionaries that use the 2nd definition do? Would a poll on this forum count at all? If I remember right, the poll/thread was locked prematurely, and this question went unanswered... -"Atheist" meaning someone who believes there is no God... well where does that leave someone who is simply without belief in God? What category do they fit into? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onewheeldave Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 Of course it does, if you believe there is no God, then you have no belief in God, by default. If you have no belief in God, it doesn't mean that you believe there is no God. The 2 definitions of 'atheist' in common use are- 'absence of belief in God' (most common amognst sceptics) and 'belief that God does not exist' (most common amongst the general public) I was pointing out that the first, does not include the second. (thought the 2nd, does include the first, of course). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onewheeldave Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 If I remember right, the poll/thread was locked prematurely, and this question went unanswered... -"Atheist" meaning someone who believes there is no God... well where does that leave someone who is simply without belief in God? What category do they fit into? Do you have a link to the thread? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atheism covers many of the categories Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RootsBooster Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 As to which category each fits into- it's just a case of being aware of the differences and making it clear which you're using. the definition IS made clear... -"Atheist" meaning someone who believes there is no God... well where does that leave someone who is simply without belief in God? What category do they fit into? So, in that case, which label is appropriate for someone without belief? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts