six45ive Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 Here we go... starting with the personal insults There's nothing insulting about making a factual statement. Or is that too militant a pov for you? Read back, it's current 'highlighted' position isn't down to me- I said straight away that it was best left alone IMO- Except you highlighted it from the video. You may wish to go back and re-read your comments after I linked to the Alain de Botton video. Far from being disingenious, i made several clear offers to 'let it lie', but you couldn't resist picking away at it could you now look what's happened, you've made it the main part of the discussion (again) Then don't respond dear boy. I'm not interested in your offers to 'let it lie'. I'm only interested in the truth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quisquose Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 No. That rather extreme example is certainly not in common usage The 2 I'm talking about, are. The 2 you're talking about, have become. My grandfather's old early 1900's dictionary simply has one line that reads "One who disbelieves the existence of a God, or Supreme intelligent Being", and that's it. That's enough, and many older dictionaries just carry this single line. The trend to insert your favoured definition (I wonder why?) into common language only really began around the time of McCarthy, to make atheists seem more dogmatic at a time when atheists were pariahs. A nice cuddly word, agnostic, could be hijacked to define those nice undecided people, the ones that are Christians really. The extreme examples I gave are mainly a continuation of this trend. They will be in common usage in many places of the world, the southern states of the US, and from many pulpits. Given this trend to attempt to tar atheists as horrible creatures through language, which includes the common usage of the term "militant atheists" btw, I cannot fault six45ive on insisting on the correct definition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
six45ive Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 Would a few links to online dictionaries that use the 2nd definition do? Would a poll on this forum count at all? Verifiable evidence would be pretty good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onewheeldave Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 The 2 you're talking about, have become. My grandfather's old early 1900's dictionary simply has one line that reads "One who disbelieves the existence of a God, or Supreme intelligent Being", and that's it. That's enough, and many older dictionaries just carry this single line. The trend to insert your favoured definition (I wonder why?) into common language only really began around the time of McCarthy, to make atheists seem more dogmatic at a time when atheists were pariahs. A nice cuddly word, agnostic, could be hijacked to define those nice undecided people, the ones that are Christians really. The extreme examples I gave are mainly a continuation of this trend. They will be in common usage in many places of the world, the southern states of the US, and from many pulpits. Given this trend to attempt to tar atheists as horrible creatures through language, which includes the common usage of the term "militant atheists" btw, I cannot fault six45ive on insisting on the correct definition. Except, of course, it's not the 'correct' definition. Sad as it may be, the current meaning of a word is not established by looking at your "grandfather's old early 1900's dictionary" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onewheeldave Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 Verifiable evidence would be pretty good. OK, go on. What possible verifiable evidence would count? And, did you decide whether a look at some online dictionaries, or a poll, would be valid or useful? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
janie48 Posted September 30, 2012 Author Share Posted September 30, 2012 (edited) Your faith is cracking. You are beginning to see the absurdity of religion. ------------------------------------------------------- Edited November 14, 2013 by janie48 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RootsBooster Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atheism covers many of the categories Although I'm not a fan of using Wikipedia as evidence, your link reinforces what I said about the term atheism as "without belief" covering anti-theists/humanists/atheism 2.0's Most inclusively, atheism is simply the absence of belief that any deities exist. *shakes your hand* Do you have a link to the thread? Yes, it's one that you took part in. Now that I've had a look back at it, I am reminded that it was one of the first threads that "Drone" wrecked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onewheeldave Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 Yes, it's one that you took part in. Now that I've had a look back at it, I am reminded that it was one of the first threads that "Drone" wrecked. Cheers http://www.sheffieldforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=1034412&highlight=atheism&page=31 By the end of it, the majority (45.61%, with 36.84% choosing 645s prefered variation) had voted for- "The belief that there is no God " which is obviously a small scale poll of just the users of this forum, yet, does correspond to what i find when asking the question of members of the general public, except that then the portion who consider it to be 'belief that God doesn't exist' tends to be more like 90% So, i'll assume 645, that your answer to the 2nd in this- Would a few links to online dictionaries that use the 2nd definition do? Would a poll on this forum count at all? will be 'no, a poll here wouldn't count' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RootsBooster Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 By the end of it, the majority (45.61%, with 36.84% choosing 645s prefered variation) had voted for- "The belief that there is no God " which is obviously a small scale poll of just the users of this forum So, like I asked in that thread (and this one), where does that leave people who simply don't have a belief in God? What are they classed as? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onewheeldave Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 So, like I asked in that thread, where does that leave people who simply don't have a belief in God? What are they classed as? They'd be atheists. As would those who beleive God doesn't exist. If you want to distinguish them from each other, some form of extra term will be necessary- this being one, of many, possible examples- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Negative_and_positive_atheism Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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