Conrod Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 Ha Ha !! Another off topic poster. The original post was about ATOS and the criminal way in which they operate. Both Labour and Conservative have used ATOS, but the Torys seem to delight in inflicting misery on poor sods with disabilities. Another FAIRER way must be found.............like accepting consultants and specialists reports and recommendations, not assessing someone in 15 minutes using a non qualified assessor, for example midwives. All we are asking for is FAIR and JUST treatment. We just get the feeling that, under the Torys this will not be possible. No political party is perfect but Labour, historically, are the lesser of 3 evils. Nye Bevan described the Torys as 'Lower than vermin'. The views and attitudes of many Conservatives reinforces that statement. Typical Tory attitude, when things get tough, blame the disadvantaged. In the meantime I will continue to 'tug my forelock' and to 'know my place'. It was attitudes like the poster above which caused the French revolution...........get your knitting needles out Madame Defarge................ Did you miss the bit where I said: "I would absolutely not wish for anybody with a genuine, debilitating condition which prevents them from working to be denied help and a reasonable standard of living through state benefits", or just choose to ignore it because it wouldn't support your line of spouting hatred for Tories? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conrod Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 Dont waste your breath mate, Torys have no compassion, concern or common sense. They just share a hatred of anyone who they class as below them. Reasoning and sensible constructive debate is barred from all Conservative meetings. You do post some silly things. Clearly there is hatred involved here - a jealous hatred by some left-wingers for those who have a better lot in life. That jealousy feeds the embittered 'them and us' divide mindset, as convincingly demonstrated in so very many of your posts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AWOL Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 Cameron will never give up on Atos.....he is certainly atosser. Forgive any grammatical errors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I1L2T3 Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 You do post some silly things. Clearly there is hatred involved here - a jealous hatred by some left-wingers for those who have a better lot in life. That jealousy feeds the embittered 'them and us' divide mindset, as convincingly demonstrated in so very many of your posts. Believing that society should provide for vulnerable people is not jealousy. You might need help yourself at some point. If you had to recover from serious burns, a spinal injury or a stroke. It's idiotic to want to deny support for other people just because you haven't suffered similar levels of misfortune. Even David Cameron, a millionaire, accepted hundreds of thousands of pounds of taxpayer help and support for his disabled son. It was right that society and the state provided support for that poor lad. None of us should begrudge a penny of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodmally Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 Believing that society should provide for vulnerable people is not jealousy. You might need help yourself at some point. If you had to recover from serious burns, a spinal injury or a stroke. It's idiotic to want to deny support for other people just because you haven't suffered similar levels of misfortune. Even David Cameron, a millionaire, accepted hundreds of thousands of pounds of taxpayer help and support for his disabled son. It was right that society and the state provided support for that poor lad. None of us should begrudge a penny of it. Ok to bring it back on topic then. The system clearly allows somepeople to fiddle the system. See the one of the examples I enclosed in my previous post (if you need more examples I can find them). So if the current system Atos isnt working then whats your alternative do nothing! Something has to be done so benefits go to those that need them not those that are fiddling the system. Take the oposition to the support for the paraolympics from Atos. These Paraolympians are hard working people that have despite a disability done really well. So why cant other people do that rather than staying on the sick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tradescanthia Posted September 30, 2012 Author Share Posted September 30, 2012 Did you miss the bit where I said: "I would absolutely not wish for anybody with a genuine, debilitating condition which prevents them from working to be denied help and a reasonable standard of living through state benefits", or just choose to ignore it because it wouldn't support your line of spouting hatred for Tories? I never hated Torys until Maggie appeared on the scene. Ol' Ted Heath was a gent, the miners treat him terribly [along with a few more loony union leaders]. Willie Whitelaw also had my respect, he was a thoroughly decent man. Its the current mob which I detest so much, they are the worst government in history. They weren't even properly elected, turncoat Clegg had to join them. They dont expect to win the next election so all they are doing is milking it as much as possible until they are thrown out. If you genuinely care, which I dont doubt you do, I cant see how you can blindly follow Tory philosophy. You havent acheived your position in life by being a numbskull. All I ask voters to do is to think "What if I was in the position where I couldn't do a full days work ??" Cameron disgusts me........thats no secret but Blair wasn't much better. There has got to be a better way of building a fairer society. I myself hate the 'them and us' situation. Personally I dont qualify for any means tested benefits as I have my own means, they are limited, but I have earned them. DLA helps such as myself to carry on working, albeit only part time but its better than begging. ATOS takes no account of anything, and politicians dont give a flying F*** either. Supporting the Torys is voting for this unfair system to carry on and maintaining the 'them and us' society. Its the old 'Divide and Rule' trick, and we fall for it all the time..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InigoMontoya Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 Nice one, Nimord. I'd like to see anyone support Atos in the light of what you've just posted. God help anyone who becomes disabled. ATOS? Why pick on ATOS? They're just the mainchancers who've been fortunate enough to land in the slurry pit of loot provided by the "Evil Twins" in charge at the DWP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tradescanthia Posted September 30, 2012 Author Share Posted September 30, 2012 Ok to bring it back on topic then. The system clearly allows somepeople to fiddle the system. See the one of the examples I enclosed in my previous post (if you need more examples I can find them). So if the current system Atos isnt working then whats your alternative do nothing! Something has to be done so benefits go to those that need them not those that are fiddling the system. Take the oposition to the support for the paraolympics from Atos. These Paraolympians are hard working people that have despite a disability done really well. So why cant other people do that rather than staying on the sick. The answe is simple, if a specialist, a surgeon an oncologist etc. says you are incapable then that should be it. Atos, using people such as trained up midwives and physio's are bending the rules and disregarding serious medical conditions and recommendations. Dont use links to the idiotic Daily Mail or The Sun to reinforce your arguments, they print bull**** sensationalism just to sell papers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodmally Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 The answe is simple, if a specialist, a surgeon an oncologist etc. says you are incapable then that should be it. Atos, using people such as trained up midwives and physio's are bending the rules and disregarding serious medical conditions and recommendations. Dont use links to the idiotic Daily Mail or The Sun to reinforce your arguments, they print bull**** sensationalism just to sell papers. Ok yes the daily mail and the sun do have an agenda (as do all papers) but these examples do exist. Some people will try to fiddle the system. The question is how do we solve this. Atos will need to be replaced by something else to stop it from happening. The benefit system needs to be policed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinfoilhat Posted September 30, 2012 Share Posted September 30, 2012 Are we all looking at this wrong ? On the last atos thread someone helpfully posted the figures of people unable to work now and unable to work in the 70s I think. The difference was massive. There must be people on the fiddle, I'm sure both "sides" in this argument would admit it. But the bigger question should be why are the Nhs not fixing people better ? If people are classed as fit for work but are in constant pain are the Nhs trying to help them or are they just masking the pain ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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