Muslim Rage-a different view?

[boyfriday]

Amish and Taliban more like.

 

Are you Amish?

[Chris_Sleeps]

I know every counter and pro Islamic argument going, and both sides are usually way wide of the mark when it comes to what's actually tught in the Quran.

That's because it's a Holy Book that contradicts itself, like virtually all Holy Books.

 

I've got this to read when I get around to it, but I've read some extracts already. However I doubt gotone has formed an opinion on anything further than his EDL forums.

[PaliRichard]

That's because it's a Holy Book that contradicts itself, like virtually all Holy Books.

 

I've got this to read when I get around to it, but I've read some extracts already. However I doubt gotone has formed an opinion on anything further than his EDL forums.

 

I've not seen that one, but I would suggest it mirrors some of the reasons why I am not a Muslim. In my opinion one of my biggest difficulties with Islam is that Muslims (actual Muslims, not nutters who fly planes into buildings) try too hard to defend it. Some of the most heated debates I've had with Muslims comes from them swearing blind that that some of the Hadith don't contradict the Quran, when they clearly do. Another personal difficulty is the shocking amount of quite clear contradictions to modern science.

 

I'm not saying that should stop them believing what they choose, and in fact there are certainly some contradictions with science in Buddhism, but I am happy to acknowledge these difficulties, I think when people of any religion simply pretend that these difficulties aren't present it undermines everything else they are trying to say.

 

As I have said time and time again, none of the extremes present the real Islam, which from my experience contains some of the warmest and most caring people I've ever met, and to answer gotones earlier question, no, I clearly wouldn't want to live next door to the guy who wants to marry my 6 year old daughter, but if I had a 6 year old daughter and lived next door to a Muslim family and a 'typical' British one, I'd leave my child with the Muslim family every time.

[Chris_Sleeps]

my experience contains some of the warmest and most caring people I've ever met

I had a burgeoning friendship with a Muslim that froze up when I said I was an athiest. When he was fasting in Ramadan I asked questions, and he was open to talk about his beliefs. When I gave mine, he said I was ignoring the obvious and he blanked me the last time we met.

 

Alas, I can't say the same thing you can. That doesn't mean all Muslims want to marry 6 year old girls though. That proposition would be silly.

[MrMoran]

I had a burgeoning friendship with a Muslim that froze up when I said I was an athiest. When he was fasting in Ramadan I asked questions, and he was open to talk about his beliefs. When I gave mine, he said I was ignoring the obvious and he blanked me the last time we met.

 

Alas, I can't say the same thing you can. That doesn't mean all Muslims want to marry 6 year old girls though. That proposition would be silly.

 

He sounds intollerant and ignorant to me.

You are better off without friends like that.

[boyfriday]

He sounds intollerant and ignorant to me.

You are better off without friends like that.

 

You didn't appreciate the 'balance' in the post? A sane but critical reflection on a relationship with a Muslim acquaintance.

[gotone]

I had a burgeoning friendship with a Muslim that froze up when I said I was an athiest. When he was fasting in Ramadan I asked questions, and he was open to talk about his beliefs. When I gave mine, he said I was ignoring the obvious and he blanked me the last time we met.

 

Alas, I can't say the same thing you can. That doesn't mean all Muslims want to marry 6 year old girls though. That proposition would be silly.

 

 

Who said or hinted they do?

 

I simply asked who you would rather live next door to.

 

As its the chippy, that turns the other cheek when you cannot or will not pay the bill, maybe just maybe his words of wisdom might have a bit more credibility than the other guy.

[PaliRichard]

I had a burgeoning friendship with a Muslim that froze up when I said I was an athiest. When he was fasting in Ramadan I asked questions, and he was open to talk about his beliefs. When I gave mine, he said I was ignoring the obvious and he blanked me the last time we met.

Alas, I can't say the same thing you can. That doesn't mean all Muslims want to marry 6 year old girls though. That proposition would be silly.

 

I can't say I've ever been blanked!

 

They often try to pursuade me I'm wrong, but it's almost always with a smile and a kind of friendly nudge, nudge 'Go on, you know you believe in your heart'.

 

I have only ever met one Muslim who held what could be described as even vaguely 'extremist' views, I was in a Masjid and even the other Muslims were telling me to watch out for him because he was a 'bit of a nutter', when he tried peddling his ideas to them they just laughed at him and told him to go and read the Quran and stop listening to 'armchair scholars'. I don't get this idea amongst some of the forum members that Muslims don't speak out against terrorism, I constantly hear them doing so.

[maxmaximus]

 

 

 

 

The fact is that if both parties actually read and understood the Quran then you'd both be wrong.

 

Shouldn't that be, read and formed an opinion on it meaning, and the problem with forming opinions from text that is 1600 years old it that everyone will likely form a different opinion, to say one is wrong whilst yours is right is the primary reason people fight and kill over religion.

 

It’s just has likely that your interpretation is wrong.

[PaliRichard]

Shouldn't that be, read and formed an opinion on it meaning, and the problem with forming opinions from text that is 1600 years old it that everyone will likely form a different opinion, to say one is wrong whilst yours is right is the primary reason people fight and kill over religion.

 

It’s just has likely that your interpretation is wrong.

 

I disagree.

 

When the context is understood the meaning is pretty straightforward, and Islam has a rich tradition of teaching the Quran in context, my independant readings reach the same conclusions as those formed by lay Muslims and Muslim scholars. There are some parts of the Quran that can't be understood in the context of itself, and these create difficulty for everyone trying to read the text, but these are very small in the context of the whole.

 

Other than that the difficulty in Islam is almost exclusively one of two things.

 

1. Muslims who try to justify the Hadith/Sunnah in the context of them contradicting the Quran, rather than accept that the suplimentary texts might be wrong they try to justify them by changing the meaning of the Quran to fit the suplimentary texts.

 

2. People who have a political agenda (eg Abu Hamza) who purposfully either twist the words of or take the verses of the Quran out of context to promote their own ideology.