RootsBooster Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 But that would apply to anyone and everyone regardless of religion since there is still nothing known about whether there is a god and what god is, presumably because nothing has ever nor can ever be known about whether there is a god and what god is?? It doesn't apply to everyone. Some people will believe that the truth can be or is known (gnosticism). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxmaximus Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 No. I was talkng about agnosticism but wasn't paying particular attention to spelling which is why I assumed max was still talking about agnosticism too. What's ignosticism? Ignosticism or igtheism is the theological position that every other theological position (including agnosticism and atheism) assumes too much about the concept of God and many other theological concepts. The view that a coherent definition of God must be presented before the question of the existence of God can be meaningfully discussed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RootsBooster Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 No. I was talkng about agnosticism but wasn't paying particular attention to spelling which is why I assumed max was still talking about agnosticism too. What's ignosticism? Ah, in that case, I agree with you that most atheists probably are agnostic, but as well as, not instead of atheist. Atheism and agnosticism are not two positions of which you can only be one or the other, they are compatible. Agnosticism/gnosticism deals with what is known or not known while atheism/theism deals with what is believed or not believed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxmaximus Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Ah, in that case, I agree with you that most atheists probably are agnostic, but as well as, not instead of atheist. Atheism and agnosticism are not two positions of which you can only be one or the other, they are compatible. Agnosticism/gnosticism deals with what is known or not known while atheism/theism deals with what is believed or not believed. I doubt it, not many athiest will have thought about it enough to conclude that nothing can be known about God. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phanerothyme Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 The view that a coherent definition of God must be presented before the question of the existence of God can be meaningfully discussed. As Spongebob might say, "good luck with that". I'm in agreement - lots of blather about god, but no-one knows what they are actually talking about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RootsBooster Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 I doubt it, not many athiest will have thought about it enough to conclude that nothing can be known about God. I disagree, most atheists will have thought about theism at some point and either realised/decided that they don't believe, or that they believe there is no God. A major factor in realising you don't believe would be that there is no evidence for it and you'll probably never know for sure anyway (to put it in simple terms). This line of thinking is basic agnosticism. They don't have to ask themselves the exact question: Do I believe or think that the truth or facts about God or gods can be known? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TeaFan Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 I bet you had a chairman Mao picture on your wall that you kissed before you went to bed though. Nah, that was Agnetha from ABBA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danot Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Your point is...? My point is that belief and knowledge about god become isolated from one another when factual evidence to support the knowledge is all to often a customary requirement of none theists or the scientific community. Belief on the other hand doesn't need factual evidence to support it, which is probably why it's a fundamental requirement of theism. In short- Holding the position of believing that there cannot be any factual knowledge about god isn't a position that anyone may choose to hold if they so desire, it's simply the situation that all of mankind is confronted with, but that doesn't mean all of mankind have to believe it is of course. That was my point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danot Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Ah, in that case, I agree with you that most atheists probably are agnostic, but as well as, not instead of atheist. Atheism and agnosticism are not two positions of which you can only be one or the other, they are compatible. Agnosticism/gnosticism deals with what is known or not known while atheism/theism deals with what is believed or not believed. Still having trouble understanding why a atheist would spend any time at all concidering whether the existance of god/s can or cannot be known before evevtually concluding it cannot? To me, that would make them agnostic, not atheist or agnostic atheist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danot Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 It doesn't apply to everyone. Some people will believe that the truth can be or is known (gnosticism). Which is what I said. They can choose to not believe whatever they want but they still know as little as you or I do or anyone else about what god is in actuallity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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