Minimum wage as opposed to Living wage. Shouldn't they be the same?

[PeteMorris]

You must get out of this habit of asking someone a question and then assuming an answer. Particularly as you have a habit of getting it wrong.

 

So no in my Utopian world I would buy anything I saw fit to buy. But if I was involved in manufacturing a product and expected increased wages then I would feel a bit of a hypocrite if I expected folk to pay over the odds to buy it to protect my job, but then went out and bought foreign myself because it was cheaper. So you probably need to ask your question of folk who were making Fords until they priced themselves out of the market.

 

Sorry. I missed the question mark!

 

So in your utopian worls nobody should buy anything manufactured anywhere but in the UK?

 

I'm not altogether sure where you sit in this debate. Do you think the minimum wage is fair? Given that in many cases it has to be topped up by benefits which you and I as taxpayers have to fund.

[L00b]

It seems some have the I'm alright Jack' syndrome and don't remember or have never been in that situation!

I know a fair few local and non-local people who -if you don't know them/don't know "where they're from"- would superficially appear to fall in that category. Large house, big cars, solid jobs, wanting for nowt...exterior signs of riches, so auto-badged into the "I'm alright Jack" brigade. I'm probably one of them myself.

 

Thing is, none of them -without exception- "don't remember or have never been in that situation". E.g. we often reminisce with our best British friends (Barnsley- and Dinnington-born) how, when I first came over around here in 1993 and met them, we used to empty our pockets on the lounge floor of their rented 1-bed flat, to see if we had enough coppers for a round at the local WMC (East Dene).

 

Maybe it's a by-product of not caring to know, or befriending, such people as you describe. Or maybe you shouldn't be so quick to broad-brush

[llamatron]

Yes, you said permanent several times.

 

What you never was temporary.

 

You said permanent full time, and part time. Neither of us said temporary and so I (quite reasonably) assumed that permanent was what we were discussing. Permanent full time, versus permanent part time.

 

I carefully said permanent twice so its perfectly reasonable for me to then discuss temporary workers. I am not having a go at you for missing it but you did "correct" me when I was the one that bought it up.

 

I was suggesting large companies should be forced to take on a percentage of permanent full time workers. Comparing them with temporary workers was just as implied as with part time workers on a contract. Particularly as I then went on to say they are cheaper to employ.

[truman]

No it's not top trumps with jobs. All I was trying to convey is that I've been on the wrong end of the ladder at various times in my life, and remember it well enough. It seems some have the I'm alright Jack' syndrome and don't remember or have never been in that situation!

 

It's an open job market..anyone can apply for anything available..people can improve themselves if they want to..but it takes a bit of effort..not just moaning and saying "it's all too hard"..

[maxmaximus]

I'm not altogether sure where you sit in this debate. Do you think the minimum wage is fair? Given that in many cases it has to be topped up by benefits which you and I as taxpayers have to fund.

 

You already fund peoples wages, so any increase will still be down to everyone to fund, if it's a public sector worker you fund it through taxation, if it’s a private sector worker you fund it through buying stuff, and what they claim to be a living wage wouldn’t take the low paid off benefits, how many low paid workers only get £40 a week in tax credits and housing benefits.

[Anna Glypta]

Sorry. I missed the question mark!

 

 

 

I'm not altogether sure where you sit in this debate. Do you think the minimum wage is fair? Given that in many cases it has to be topped up by benefits which you and I as taxpayers have to fund.

 

Regarding the private sector I have no cross to bare. As far as I'm concerned folk can pay themselves or ask the boss for anything that they can get. If that makes the business non competitive and the company closes or shifts production abroad then they only have themselves to blame.

Regarding the public sector I agree that there should be tight budget controls. Again councils/employers can pay what they like. If that means they haven't the cash to keep folk in work that's up to them. If as a result they have to cut services then that's a different matter. There's no such thing as a free lunch. Whenever someone gets paid more someone has to provide the cash.

[Cyclone]

I carefully said permanent twice so its perfectly reasonable for me to then discuss temporary workers.

I agree, it is reasonable. But you didn't say temporary, so I thought we were still discussing permie vs permie.

I am not having a go at you for missing it but you did "correct" me when I was the one that bought it up.

Lol, true.

 

I was suggesting large companies should be forced to take on a percentage of permanent full time workers. Comparing them with temporary workers was just as implied as with part time workers on a contract.

I might agree that they should be restricted in the use of temp workers, but full time/part time is irrelevant in my opinion.

[llamatron]

I agree, it is reasonable. But you didn't say temporary, so I thought we were still discussing permie vs permie.

Lol, true.

I might agree that they should be restricted in the use of temp workers, but full time/part time is irrelevant in my opinion.

 

that may be because you are a skilled worker with a full time job.

[PeteMorris]

I know a fair few local and non-local people who -if you don't know them/don't know "where they're from"- would superficially appear to fall in that category. Large house, big cars, solid jobs, wanting for nowt...exterior signs of riches, so auto-badged into the "I'm alright Jack" brigade. I'm probably one of them myself.

 

Thing is, none of them -without exception- "don't remember or have never been in that situation". E.g. we often reminisce with our best British friends (Barnsley- and Dinnington-born) how, when I first came over around here in 1993 and met them, we used to empty our pockets on the lounge floor of their rented 1-bed flat, to see if we had enough coppers for a round at the local WMC (East Dene).

 

Maybe it's a by-product of not caring to know, or befriending, such people as you describe. Or maybe you shouldn't be so quick to broad-brush

 

I wasn't attempting to broad brush. I can only comment on the things other posters put on here.

 

Yes if you have a good job, then in all likelihood you've worked hard to get there. Some people are more intelligent than others, we know that. Some people have a singular determination to get wherever they're going. Some people are articulate enough to voice their opinions.

 

On the other hand, some people are perhaps not that intelligent, some people are not very articulate, some people may have had any number of problems in their life which prevented them from being 'one of the elite'. And yes, some people are bone idle!!!!

 

You can bet that there are fair few people following this thread and afraid or not articulate enough to put their two-penneth into the debate for fear of being made mincemeat out of by the 'clever' ones.

 

Society is made up of a completely diverse set of people, some clever, some, not so. Yet everyone should be valued in society, not looked down upon because they're unskilled.

[truman]

Society is made up of a completely diverse set of people, some clever, some, not so. Yet everyone should be valued in society, not looked down upon because they're unskilled.

 

I don't look down on anyone..I just realise that different jobs require different skills and therefore a different wage...