Obelix Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 Over it's lifetime. Can I just amend that a little please... a Toyota Pious does more damage to the environment than a 5 series BMW. That's the problem as you clearly put it. Stop start has become "possible" in that the first owner of the car won't complain and so the manufacturers can tap into the piousity as it were, and make money. Sadly that's at the expense of the second and third owners of the car.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteMorris Posted November 12, 2012 Author Share Posted November 12, 2012 Pete: What you were told years ago was true. Now the manufacturers and PR guys are just telling a load of new-age muppets what they want to hear. It just makes me wonder how this new tech will fare in the second hand market. It maybe a subversive ploy to design them no further a life span than say 5 years. But of course that's a cynical view....I wouldn't dream of being so cynical...would I? But I do think they will be a problem after a few years of motoring though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frededwards Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 I think ABS will be more of a concern, once the road crud and moisture start to attack the wheel speed sensors and cabling........................... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L00b Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 It just makes me wonder how this new tech will fare in the second hand market.2nd hand car buyers will just have to do their homework, and diligently check service records of cars they see, more than ever. As is already the case now, for known model faults/recalls. Take a DPF, for example: it's not been changed (of the seller cannot prove it has been changed) at the recommended service interval (usually around 75k)? That'll be £1,000 (at least) off the asking price, please. That's if you know to ask about it beforehand, of course. If you don't...well...caveat emptor, an'all that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garbo Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 It says here that: They 'virtually all' continue to use conventional Lead Acid batteries? or can you have a lead acid gel?...eeeek! yes you can, the agm batteries are the ones designed for stop start, and if the battery cant do it, the ecu wont stop the engine. basically, the entire engine and car has been designed to operate and be lubricated sufficiently. it is also inhibited during a dpf regeneration. Also, everyone i have spoken to with a dpf problem has been someone who has a diesel for short round town sort of driving. I think ABS will be more of a concern, once the road crud and moisture start to attack the wheel speed sensors and cabling........................... abs has been round since the early 1970s and is a system that genuinely does improve safety, hence why its mandatory on all new cars. the sensors do go faulty from time to time, but its generally a very reliable system Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyclone Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 1. That’s a manufacturers claim, not independently verified. And under the ideal conditions I expect. I'm sure someone has actually tested it though, are no figures available? 2. Additional start-ups will emit more environmental contaminants than conventional engines. Will they, if it's as efficient as claimed then overall these engines will emit less. 3. As stated earlier, the battery life is shortened leading to additional cost and pollution. They put heavy duty batteries in, designed for multiple cycles. Is there any evidence that they have a shorter life than in a normal car? 4. The engine life may well be shortened leading to addition cost and/or earlier scrappage, therefore potentially greater environmental damage. Modern engines generally outlive the useful life of the car, so I doubt this is a factor at all. Over it's lifetime, a Toyota Prius does more damage to the environment than a 5 series BMW. We aren't talking about electric cars that are full of LiON batteries though (where most of the environmental damage of the prius comes from). Nor would I ever recommend to anyone to buy or use one. I completely agree that they are not in any way environmentally friendly. But the fact that a prius is not environmentally friendly is unrelated to start/stop technology. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyclone Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 I think ABS will be more of a concern, once the road crud and moisture start to attack the wheel speed sensors and cabling........................... It fails back to a standard full application braking system. I've heard nothing about ABS being a problem on even 15 year old cars, and that's about the lifespan of the average vehicle isn't it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyclone Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 Pete: What you were told years ago was true. Now the manufacturers and PR guys are just telling a load of new-age muppets what they want to hear. I appreciate a high level of cynicism, but this time I'd like to see figures from some independent testing before I come down on one side or the other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truman Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 Yeah I've been there before....My old mini (pre-BMW) :hihi: I used to have one of those....was driving along minding my business one day and I heard a really loud BANG! from the boot...stopped and opened it up..a can of Castrol GTX (I think),one of the old metal ones you used to get, had fallen over onto the battery and shorted the terminals...cue an hour and half of trying to get 5 litres of oil cleaned out of the boot.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truman Posted November 12, 2012 Share Posted November 12, 2012 They put heavy duty batteries in, designed for multiple cycles. Is there any evidence that they have a shorter life than in a normal car? I've had my car for just under a year and driven 34,000 miles,the battery has shown no hesitation at all when the car has restarted itself... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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