Allotments have become a necessity.

[NewBiz]

You don't need much labour to produce food. And many still have access to food, but increasing numbers of people do not.

 

But if you have no ability to produce food then your screwed, unless you can access food. Many people have been denied access to food, via land price rises and falling wages and unemployment.

 

If there was more access to land, we would all be better off for it. 1 unemployed man could grow food for many, and they could all work together and create new employment and trade and thus prosperity.

 

Still more waffling piffle I'm afraid.

 

chem1st have you ever thought of getting a job so you can buy food, and have a decent roof over your head? I know it might mean having to give up your hobby of posting complete random crap about 'housing crisis' and 'property being theft' etc but would probably do you a power of good..........if you can find someone to employ you that is.

[andygardener]

Working for others is not a way to reduce poverty, slavery proved this. The only way to reduce poverty is to increase people's access to land. China's growth can be explained by this, India's somewhat also (but India is not as forward thinking as China and lags behind)

 

Agriculturally China has gone from one of the the least productive countries on earth under Mao to the most productive. Trust me, it's not been because of allotments. The vast majority of production is at agribusiness level and utilizes cutting edge technology, including GM. Even given that, agriculture is a small slice of overall output in china and an even smaller slice of exports.

 

Suggesting that China's growth has been driven by increasing private access to land for the purpose of growing food is utterly ludicrous, even by your standards.

[chem1st]

From that quote alone I can deduce that you have never produced food!

 

I have produced relatively small amounts, and the amount of food I am producing is increasing as I increase my access to land.

 

I find it funny how you don't agree with me, when you live in the place that gave birth to the great man, Henry George.

 

He wrote this;

 

I asked a passing teamster, for want of something better to say, what land was worth there. He pointed to some cows grazing so far off that they looked like mice, and said, 'I don't know exactly, but there is a man over there who will sell some land for a thousand dollars an acre.' Like a flash it came over me that there was the reason of advancing poverty with advancing wealth. With the growth of population, land grows in value, and the men who work it must pay more for the privilege

 

His ideas helped spawn the board game, 'monopoly' via "the landlord's game", which is essentially an educational game that teaches us the problems resulting from land ownership - how it impoverishes the landless and enriches landowners, without any respect to the value people create! (Such a shame people didn't heed the message of this widely played game in this country and believe they can get rich by taking on mortgage debt! - perhaps at the expense of others, yes, but the sheer amount doing it has led to the impoverishment of us all!)

 

He argued for fair taxation - Land Value Tax. An LVT would encourage proper use of land, and ensure it was fair (if levied at the correct rates).

 

His ideas are well rooted, Adam Smith himself was in favour of LVT. Silvio Gessel too, and he showed how to tackle both the land problem and the currency problem and bring about mass employment and prosperity! Worgl of 1931 is testament to this.

[chem1st]

Agriculturally China has gone from one of the the least productive countries on earth under Mao to the most productive. Trust me, it's not been because of allotments. The vast majority of production is at agribusiness level and utilizes cutting edge technology, including GM. Even given that, agriculture is a small slice of overall output in china and an even smaller slice of exports.

 

Suggesting that China's growth has been driven by increasing private access to land for the purpose of growing food is utterly ludicrous, even by your standards.

 

China didn't just increase people's access to land for food production. It did it for housing and business aswell. NIMBY's did not oppose the building of factories and the birth of great cities that produce in abundance due to the fear of lower house prices. China developed. And ironically, because of it' development, it became a more desirable place to live and work.

 

China's success is one resulting from access to land.

[chem1st]

Still more waffling piffle I'm afraid.

 

chem1st have you ever thought of getting a job so you can buy food, and have a decent roof over your head? I know it might mean having to give up your hobby of posting complete random crap about 'housing crisis' and 'property being theft' etc but would probably do you a power of good..........if you can find someone to employ you that is.

 

I do work, and I combine short spells of unemployment with work, it makes sense to do so. I do different things, always trying something new. I've been unemployed, done PAYE, self employed and even gave work to others.

 

I can buy food and have plenty of it, I also produce a small amount of my own, but this amount is increasing. I have a decent roof over my head.

 

That's not to say I don't want better and to do more. My problem is, it is very hard for most people to do so in the first place. I believe that everyone should be able to grow some of their own food if they wish, that every man should have a right to a decent roof over his head.

 

Without access to land, people can't provide a roof over their head and better themselves as well as what they could if they did, they might not even be able to do so at all.

 

Sanman quoted somebody earlier who started Loxley Community Farm. LCF proves my point - access to land is good. People gained access to land and they worked it and they created value, and Sheffield is better off as a whole due to the increased access to land at LCF.

[tinfoilhat]

China didn't just increase people's access to land for food production. It did it for housing and business aswell. NIMBY's did not oppose the building of factories and the birth of great cities that produce in abundance due to the fear of lower house prices. China developed. And ironically, because of it' development, it became a more desirable place to live and work.

 

China's success is one resulting from access to land.

 

Chinese cities a desirable place to live ? Shoddy building practices, overcrowding and pollution that you can't even begin to comprehend ?

 

What on earth are you comparing it to ?

[sanman]

Sanman quoted somebody earlier who started Loxley Community Farm. LCF proves my point - access to land is good. People gained access to land and they worked it and they created value, and Sheffield is better off as a whole due to the increased access to land at LCF.

 

LVCF does not prove your point; it proves mine.

 

And the point is if you want land you can get it, you just have to have determination and work for it.

[neepsendlane]

Plenty of people grow their own food.

 

People who don't have land can rent an allotment. Am I right in thinking that your problem with all of this is that you think people who do not own property or land should be given free use of land they do not own to grow their weed/potatoes?

The Duke of Devonshire or Welbeck, or Norfolk could give us a couple of hundred acres back! Then the peasants can grow food.

[neepsendlane]

why will many people in the UK to become like "poor black people in Detroit"?

What is the difference Detroit or Darnall if you are out of work and skint .

[neepsendlane]

Have you seen the gardens in some of the council property?

Plenty of opportunity to turn them over and grow veg. All they seem capable of cultivating is dog turds, fridges and scrap.

If things were that bad surely we would see every garden growing veg.

As someone stated previously, it's not just a case of turning the dirt over and throwing in some seeds.

I grow tomatoes, salad veg etc and when I sit and work it out it is actually cheaper to buy the stuff in the first place.

So all owner occupiers have well trimmed gardens full of taters and cabbage do they.

Some of the council houses on our estate have gardens that win prizes.