ricgem2002 Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 2 Million in expenses!!! Wonder what Ricky and Joseph will have to say about this! what have the rest of the parties claimed? . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeffrey Shaw Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 It seems that we pay about 10% of UK's GDP to the ever-greedy EU. We sure don't receive anything like that in value for money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andygardener Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 EUlite...two tier Europe with us on the outside looking in, begs the question why we'd want that sort of arrangement so UKIP's campaign to exit the EU completely would still be there. Obviously it depends how good a job Cameron does of negotiating with the rest of the EU members as to what would be a beneficial relationship for Britain with the EU core. If it preserves the majority of economical benefits while returning the majority of sovereignty to the UK then UKIP will have a hard time persuading people on the right of the Conservative party to risk Tory seats by voting UKIP. If the rest of the EU flat out won't play ball then I can see the Conservatives being left with no option but to campaign on an in-out referendum, and backing out. The only way UKIP will have traction is if the proposal on the table is a bit of tinkering round the edges but no fundamental restructuring of our relationship with the core, and the commission. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyofborg Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 It seems that we pay about 10% of UK's GDP to the ever-greedy EU. where do you get that figure? these show only 0.64% GDP contributed...... http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datablog/2012/nov/22/eu-budget-spending-contributions-european-union Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyofborg Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 Obviously it depends how good a job Cameron does of negotiating with the rest of the EU members as to what would be a beneficial relationship for Britain with the EU core. that presumes that what cameron considers to be a beneficial relationship is actually a beneficial one for everyone not just his rich buddies. If it preserves the majority of economical benefits while returning the majority of sovereignty to the UK what sovereignty do you want back? people quote switzerland and norway as examples of countries outside the eu which access the single market, but they both to implement all directives relating to the single market, and they have no significant input as to what they actually are. i think the best we could hope for would be a similar sort of deal, which means we aren't going to get that much sovereignty back and we aren't going to be in much of a negotiating position regarding any future directives. the other thing is that for, better or worse, much of eu finance flows through london, i'm not sure how much of that would survive if we were outside the eu. there are already attempts to limit the eurozone transactions which come through london, i doubt we would be able to save though if we were outside. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyofborg Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 What the EU has lacked over the last few years has been strong leadership, if Cameron had had a bit more vision and some courage he could have been providing it. With very little effort we could have been one of the leading visionaries of the non-euro countries and rather than just chiding the eurozone countries about their failings we could have been providing constructive encouragement and help for them to help sort their mess out. It might not have been easy or quick, but with a bit of effort we could have remade the EU. It's irritating to write this but the only leaders we've had over the last 30 years who could have done that were Blair, especially if he hadn't got involved in Iraq and Afghanistan, and Brown. Possibly, if she was here now then Thatcher could have done it as well, but things were different in the 80s and there wasn't the leadership vaccuum there is now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andygardener Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 that presumes that what cameron considers to be a beneficial relationship is actually a beneficial one for everyone not just his rich buddies. what sovereignty do you want back? people quote switzerland and norway as examples of countries outside the eu which access the single market, but they both to implement all directives relating to the single market, and they have no significant input as to what they actually are. i think the best we could hope for would be a similar sort of deal, which means we aren't going to get that much sovereignty back and we aren't going to be in much of a negotiating position regarding any future directives. the other thing is that for, better or worse, much of eu finance flows through london, i'm not sure how much of that would survive if we were outside the eu. there are already attempts to limit the eurozone transactions which come through london, i doubt we would be able to save though if we were outside. Neither Norway or Switzerland have contributed billions more than they get back from the EU, nor do they have a veto over any treaty changes and many areas of policy. So to suggest the best deal we can get is what they got is rather underplaying our hand. What I want in terms of sovereignty being returned is first and foremost that parliament is the source of legislation for the UK and where parliament enact law that contradicts EU dictats then UK law has primacy and the EU dictats are null and void. Further to that any new legislation from the EU should have to be put before parliament for approval. You know, sovereignty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeffrey Shaw Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 where do you get that figure? An economist who works for the Daily Telegraph: Tim Congdon. See UKIP's website where his Report is available: http://www.timcongdon4ukip.com/docs/UKIP%20Cost%20of%20the%20EU.pdf But then The Guardian would scarcely be giving his findings any publicity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aliceBB Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 It seems that we pay about 10% of UK's GDP to the ever-greedy EU. We sure don't receive anything like that in value for money. I'm not sure how useful such emotive language is! Perhaps you should declare the full extent of your interest here, Mr Shaw. Did you not stand as a UKIP candidate in Sheffield at the last General Election? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andygardener Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 Lordy, wasn't aware of that. While there's no need to declare personal political affiliations not mentioning you're the local UKIP treasurer seems a tad off. Still, with a beard like that and store santa season upon us crack a smile and don the relevant outfit and the coffers will be full in no time! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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