LeMaquis Posted December 18, 2012 Share Posted December 18, 2012 I was a regular attendee at Hillsborough for many years to watch my team, the Owls play many a game in that stadium. If I went with my dad we always sat in the stands........ All well and good but it has nothing to do with gun control where you live now. Football violence has been a lot worse than what you've just described at Hillsborough because English football fans take the game too seriously and are prepared to maim, even kill, in support of their club. So if we had widespread gun ownership over here I wonder how much worse violence would be. You're just making out that us English are violent too, which we are, but football violence is now largely under control compared to the 70s and 80s although it still goes on. And compared to gun violence in the USA, well there is no comparison. The odd bit of trouble in a football ground here is nothing compared to Newtown, Columbine, etc. The worst incidents in grounds over here - Bradford, Hillsborough, Ibrox - weren't even to do with violence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phanerothyme Posted December 18, 2012 Share Posted December 18, 2012 Tim Berners-Lee - sorry. In case no-one noticed Berners-Lee invented the hypertext transfer protocol (http), NOT "the internet", which is a 100% American invention, with its roots in the Defence Department. It owes its success to packet switching, which is a British invention though. Who invented what is a pretty irrelevant argument for anything - trading on the glories of others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harleyman Posted December 18, 2012 Share Posted December 18, 2012 I'd really rather not thanks. I don't think they're in any way relevant. I'd rather ask you how you'd respond to reports that some commentators (and possibly politicians - or is that a rumour?) have seriously suggested that teachers be armed. I have not heard one single word on any news channel about teachers being armed. The idea seems completely ludicrous. I see the young women teachers at the school where my grandaughters attend and cannot imagine for a moment any of them packing an automatic. Most of them would refuse to anyway and I can understand that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
janie48 Posted December 18, 2012 Share Posted December 18, 2012 I subscribed to the other thread,regarding gun crime.I didn't offer my condolences i just stuck to the topic being discussed. I would like to think that it would have been generally assumed that sympathy was felt by all the contributers for the victims and bereaved even though that may have not been expressed in words,i'm sure thats the case really,because i honestly think there are many people who prefer not to reveal their thoughts when they feel something deeply,but that doesn't have to mean they don't care or feel empathy for those suffering. There has been so much coverage in the media about gun crimes,with news crews reporting from the US and interviewing Americans with different views,its natural that much of the focus,would be on that issue. I do think that we should take into account though that North America is larger then Europe,though i don't know the population statistics,what i'm trying to say is we can't compare the US with our own Country,and the gun culture issue is more complex then we can ever imagine unless we live in the States. What is obvious is that the nation has been in shock since this happened with mixed reactions, angry emotions, and pain. Anyone who remembers Dunblane will remember that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melthebell Posted December 18, 2012 Share Posted December 18, 2012 just seen this mentioned at the end of an article about the first two funerals from the shooting on sky news Meanwhile, an 11-year-old boy allegedly brought a gun into school in Salt Lake City, Utah. The unnamed child said he was defending himself in case of an attack similar to the Sandy Hook massacre, according to police. He was arrested on suspicion of possessing a dangerous weapon and aggravated assault after other students told officers he pointed the handgun at them on a field at an elementary school. Officials say staff confronted the boy in class after hearing he had a weapon and seized the unloaded gun and ammunition from his rucksack. scary, that kids as young as 11, even younger can get guns and ammunition Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harleyman Posted December 18, 2012 Share Posted December 18, 2012 It seems from the news at lunch time that sales of the AR-15 Bushmaster semi-automatic are soaring due to the anticipated ban on such weapons. That weapon is a variation of the military M-16 of which I'm very familiar with. It's not a weapon to be trifled with and comes with a deadly bit of firepower. I'm not anticipating a sudden surge in the number of violent home invasions so I wont go out and buy one. Neither could I take one to the mall or the cinema even if I had one so I cant understand what all the crap is about "needing one for defence" Fat lot of use if you're in a mall and someone starst shooting while all your defensive firepower is locked up at home miles away. This is making me alll dizzy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melthebell Posted December 18, 2012 Share Posted December 18, 2012 I have not heard one single word on any news channel about teachers being armed. The idea seems completely ludicrous. I see the young women teachers at the school where my grandaughters attend and cannot imagine for a moment any of them packing an automatic. Most of them would refuse to anyway and I can understand that i saw it mentioned on sky news last night, that a couple of congressmen or whoever had mentioned it as a possible solution rather than gun control edit:- just found it mentioned on fox news lol http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/12/18/stop-school-shootings-by-letting-teachers-fire-back-say-texas-officials/ Lawmakers and educators in Texas say the way to guard against school shootings like last Friday's at a Connecticut elementary school is to make sure teachers can shoot back. ive already given my view on why i dont think itll work http://www.sheffieldforum.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9421396&postcount=161 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harleyman Posted December 18, 2012 Share Posted December 18, 2012 I subscribed to the other thread,regarding gun crime.I didn't offer my condolences i just stuck to the topic being discussed. I would like to think that it would have been generally assumed that sympathy was felt by all the contributers for the victims and bereaved even though that may have not been expressed in words,i'm sure thats the case really,because i honestly think there are many people who prefer not to reveal their thoughts when they feel something deeply,but that doesn't have to mean they don't care or feel empathy for those suffering. There has been so much coverage in the media about gun crimes,with news crews reporting from the US and interviewing Americans with different views,its natural that much of the focus,would be on that issue. I do think that we should take into account though that North America is larger then Europe,though i don't know the population statistics,what i'm trying to say is we can't compare the US with our own Country,and the gun culture issue is more complex then we can ever imagine unless we live in the States. What is obvious is that the nation has been in shock since this happened with mixed reactions, angry emotions, and pain. Anyone who remembers Dunblane will remember that. I think when you have very young kids in your family as we do, garndaughters 8, 6 and 3 that these kind of atrocities hit much closer to home. The other night we watched the Mass for the victims held in Newtown. President Obama was among the mourners and spoke at length to the gathering. The hardest part is when they showed the names and photos of these children. My wife was in tears and me close to it We've all suffered some degree of trauma. There's a closeness based on that Connecticut is a State in the country we live in and most of us are very happy to live in and other ways that have affected us also The day after the shooting occured I was bringing two of the kids to our house after school. The music on the car radio was interrupted by the latest news of the shooting. I didnt want the kids to hear any of it so turned the radio off quickly We also have to watch the news out of the way on the TV in our bedroom when the kids are at our house You never know how they could react. They might not want to go to school and I dont want to hear any of them ask "Will anyone come and shoot us at our school"? ---------- Post added 18-12-2012 at 21:29 ---------- i saw it mentioned on sky news last night, that a couple of congressmen or whoever had mentioned it as a possible solution rather than gun controledit:- just found it mentioned on fox news lol http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/12/18/stop-school-shootings-by-letting-teachers-fire-back-say-texas-officials/ ive already given my view on why i dont think itll work http://www.sheffieldforum.co.uk/showpost.php?p=9421396&postcount=161 Well they're daft Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fivetide Posted December 18, 2012 Share Posted December 18, 2012 When my son and I were in the ICU following a car accident that killed my wife in 1979, we were inundated with phone messages from all over America, Canada, and the UK expressing sympathy and offering help. we were totally alone in this country with only one relative living in Texas, but those messages let us know that we were not alone, and helped us recover. To say offers of condolence don't help signifies that you have probably never suffered grief or are impervious to it. I hope this is not the case. I am extremely sorry for your loss, but it wasn't my intention, nor my message that 'offers of condolence don't help'. I said it didn't feel to me as though offers of condolence posted on websites and sent to news media would help. Phone messages are personal. The websites of news media organisations are less so. I also made it clear it was my own reaction to the tragedy, and made the explicit point that I wasn't criticising anyone else's response, and explicitly asked no-one criticised my own. To suggest I have never suffered grief, or am impervious to it, is perhaps a natural reaction, but sadly this is not the case. Like every human on the planet I have lost loved ones, and still grieve for them on a daily basis. I personally would never express the hope that another person has suffered loss. I hope you find a way to deal with your sorrow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dosxuk Posted December 18, 2012 Share Posted December 18, 2012 I didn't gloat Who is? There is only one post on this thread which I would say could be classed as gloating, by "bigging up" how amazing they think their country is in a bizarre way to justify why the general public need assault weapons. People saying they're shocked that so many young children can be killed through no fault of their own and wanting to discuss why it happened and how it can be stopped from happening again is not gloating. Saying that you're less likely to be shot in the UK than the US is not gloating. Saying that owning five or more guns is excessive is not gloating. Saying that there are too many of these types of events in the US is not gloating. Some are opinions, some can be backed up with statistics and are therefore facts. Pointing out those facts is still not gloating though. If you want a thread which is just for condolances and sympathy posts, you could create your own, as it is patently not what this thread was set up to discuss. The question posed in the very first post was, after all, "one has to ask will the USA ever take serious steps to limit the access of the public to firearms?". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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