andygardener Posted January 22, 2013 Share Posted January 22, 2013 democracy was originally Greece's and Britain has only had something we'd recognize as democracy for only around 90 years Well all the more reason to hang onto this new invention then. It's staggering the contempt in which democracy is held by the EU commission and their supporters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyofborg Posted January 22, 2013 Share Posted January 22, 2013 Well all the more reason to hang onto this new invention then. It's staggering the contempt in which democracy is held by the EU commission and their supporters. just out of interest, which bits do you feel are undemocratic? eu legislation originates in the commission but it then has to be approved by the eu parliament and the council of ministers both of which are elected. it then has to be implemented by each national parliament. part of the criticism of eu legislation is that national governments tend to add their own stuff on the top of the eu requirements. the commissioners are appointed by national governments and can be dismissed by the eu parliament the president is appointed by both the council of ministers and the parliament. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erebus Posted January 22, 2013 Share Posted January 22, 2013 Its about time we left the EEC, and then we could see how well the city of London does is funding the country through government taxes. Well how long do you think the financial global sector would stay in London, where financial fraud is the name of the game, or heads they win and tails you lose. Where our industry, our industry where foreign companies started building factories here just so they had a back door facility to get round import taxed to the EEC. So will our so called industry stay loyal?? Money making has no country, so they will close. More on benefits in the long run. The city is about money, and money has no conscience, and they will start moving to the far East, where growth at 7% a year is regarded by our experts, as countries going into a recession like us. We will believe anything we are fed, and I hope we follow up on the nonsense and get out of EUROPE. Will the USA stand by us, as we love American culture and American values, where decent people have money and trash people have little or nothing. Let us leave the EEC, just so we can once and for all decide which side of the stale bread, we want some butter on. Only through suffering will people be persuaded, and it might take a decade, or so, but we will plead to rejoin, as we will have found that going it alone, will expose the myth we only have special relationships and friends, like the USA. They will do nothing, we will create our own destruction based on the greed of the City of London laying golden eggs every year, which helps pay the interest on the money we owe to the banks we bailed out for nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xt500 Posted January 22, 2013 Share Posted January 22, 2013 Do people really believe they will ever get a vote? Dream on!! You wont because they already know the answer! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andygardener Posted January 22, 2013 Share Posted January 22, 2013 just out of interest, which bits do you feel are undemocratic? eu legislation originates in the commission but it then has to be approved by the eu parliament and the council of ministers both of which are elected. it then has to be implemented by each national parliament. part of the criticism of eu legislation is that national governments tend to add their own stuff on the top of the eu requirements. the commissioners are appointed by national governments and can be dismissed by the eu parliament the president is appointed by both the council of ministers and the parliament. The people seem to be conspicuously absent from all of that. The EU on paper will claim it's democratic, in reality it is anything but. Witness the snake Barosso demanding cuts in national budgets while demanding a huge increase in his budget from the same governments because "national budgets are being cut so the EU must step in to help those affected by the cuts". Is this what the people of Europe want? Did they vote for it? No. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeffrey Shaw Posted January 23, 2013 Share Posted January 23, 2013 democracy was originally Greece's Er, not quite- it was not for women, and it was not for all adult men either. So not democratic at all, really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FANAdeLdF Posted January 24, 2013 Share Posted January 24, 2013 just out of interest, which bits do you feel are undemocratic? eu legislation originates in the commission but it then has to be approved by the eu parliament and the council of ministers both of which are elected. it then has to be implemented by each national parliament. part of the criticism of eu legislation is that national governments tend to add their own stuff on the top of the eu requirements. the commissioners are appointed by national governments and can be dismissed by the eu parliament the president is appointed by both the council of ministers and the parliament. A very good summary. southcoast and andygardener can bang on about the EU's democratic deficit until the cows come home, but the question remains : what's so desirable, let alone democratic, about a Westminster system in which up to 49.9% of the votes in a constituency count for nothing because the winner takes all; in which the two main parties can parachute their cronies into safe seats willy-nilly ; and in which an unelected (!) House of Lords can water down legislation that was passed by representatives who were elected by those flawed rules ? And that's before even considering that the parliamentary opposition can huff and puff, but can't change a thing about government policies in between national elections, seeing that there are zero institutional checks and balances in place. No democratically mandated ones, anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harleyman Posted January 24, 2013 Share Posted January 24, 2013 The people seem to be conspicuously absent from all of that. The EU on paper will claim it's democratic, in reality it is anything but. Witness the snake Barosso demanding cuts in national budgets while demanding a huge increase in his budget from the same governments because "national budgets are being cut so the EU must step in to help those affected by the cuts". Is this what the people of Europe want? Did they vote for it? No. What's democratic about a House of Lords of unelected officials who have the power to pass legislation? Is there any other country in the EU that has a system of government like that? I doubt it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vinyl Posted January 24, 2013 Share Posted January 24, 2013 What's democratic about a House of Lords of unelected officials who have the power to pass legislation? Is there any other country in the EU that has a system of government like that? I doubt it. I see you have scant knowledge of how the UK Parliamentary system works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
green Posted January 24, 2013 Share Posted January 24, 2013 Maybe its time we forced our MPs to act to change the present system? When's the last time you wrote to him/her? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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