What's the difference between Communism and Fascism?

[LeMaquis]

I will. They're running on capital bouncing around their system. They buy and sell private property, from the west and to the west, to make profit. They're capitalist.

 

It has to at least have some common theme between it.

 

Certainly. Western Europe had, and still has, nationalised industry, but we aren't communist.

 

If it (China) were communist then the concept of private property would not hold,but China has promoted private enterprise,despite retaining an autocratic power structure.It is in fact a mixed economy.

 

You both assume that there is only one communist model, the Soviet model. There is no rule that private property cannot exist in a communist society. There was in fact private property in the USSR. Capital and land were state owned but there was private property owned by individuals.

 

The differences between a market economy and a communist economy are not so black and white as you think. Just about all advanced economies are mixed economies but ownership isn't everything. The Deng Xiaoping Theory dominates current Chinese economic policy based on Deng's belief that communism and private capital could co-exist. The communist state in China allows private capital but still controls massive amounts of the economy, as well as the army and political power through the Communist Party.

 

I accept that at some point reforms in China could tip the economy into being predominantly capitalist but that hasn't happened yet and would necessitate a massive collapse of the Chinese Communist Party's political, military and economic control.

[JFKvsNixon]

I think the roots of that war began when the treaty of Versailles sought to humiliate Germany-this sense of hurt pride made the German people amenable to Hitlers rhetoric.WW2 was never a war against communism.

 

I believe that the roots of the WWII was bound up in the allies failure to comprehensively defeat the Prussian military culture in WWI. WWI was a political defeat defeat for the Germans and as such the country didn't feel defeated.

[janie48]

 

Didnt Putin have a female rock group arrested for busting into a church during a service and singing songs about religion which were not respectful.

Yes Pussy Riot,very interestingly discussed on here.

 

http://www.sheffieldforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=1034856&highlight=pussy+riot&page=18

 

Not through lack of trying though. tens of thousands of priests and church-goers were imprisoned/tortured/executed during the states attempt to eliminate the Orthodix church.

They killed the people but they couldn't kill the church.

The knowledge of what had happened in Communist Russia and fear of the spread of Communism was why the fascist regime gained so much power and support because most of the German nation were blind to the true nature of its evil,but many members of the clergy recognised this and spoke against it to the people in their congregations,if they were caught by the Gestapo spies they were arrested and sent to Concentration camps,many survived but approx a thousand of them were sent to the gas chambers.

[gnvqsos]

You both assume that there is only one communist model, the Soviet model. There is no rule that private property cannot exist in a communist society. There was in fact private property in the USSR. Capital and land were state owned but there was private property owned by individuals.

 

The differences between a market economy and a communist economy are not so black and white as you think. Just about all advanced economies are mixed economies but ownership isn't everything. The Deng Xiaoping Theory dominates current Chinese economic policy based on Deng's belief that communism and private capital could co-exist. The communist state in China allows private capital but still controls massive amounts of the economy, as well as the army and political power through the Communist Party.

 

I accept that at some point reforms in China could tip the economy into being predominantly capitalist but that hasn't happened yet and would necessitate a massive collapse of the Chinese Communist Party's political, military and economic control.

 

I would never assert we have had communism ,as both China and the USSR were using this as a means of justifying oppression.Some advocate both were a form of state capitalism,where the people are exploited to benefit an elite bureaucracy,nuclear weapons and other instruments of aggression.

[Harleyman]

I believe that the roots of the WWII was bound up in the allies failure to comprehensively defeat the Prussian military culture in WWI. WWI was a political defeat defeat for the Germans and as such the country didn't feel defeated.

 

I think they knew what defeat meant well enough since the whole country was on the verge of total starvation in Niovember 1918.

 

The harsh punitive measures imposed on the country by the Treaty of Versailles accompanied by the state of political anarchy made it an ideal situation for someone like Hitler to come along.

[janie48]

I think they knew what defeat meant well enough since the whole country was on the verge of total starvation in Niovember 1918.

 

The harsh punitive measures imposed on the country by the Treaty of Versailles accompanied by the state of political anarchy made it an ideal situation for someone like Hitler to come along.

In view of that and the subsequent depression, is a reason why the people were fooled into thinking he was a great leader when he came to power,with the party introducing measures that appeared to help the economy very quickly and provide jobs for the many who had been unemployed.

[lizmachin]

If you're Jewish, Catholic or a person of colour you have no place in a Fascist society

 

If you're Jewish, Catholic or a person of colour you are welcome in a Communist society

 

 

So why was religion stamped upon and the Jews driven out of the USSR? Yet in Fascist Italy the Vatican was in league with Mussolini.

[janie48]

So why was religion stamped upon and the Jews driven out of the USSR? Yet in Fascist Italy the Vatican was in league with Mussolini.

 

The Vatican had to pretend to be in league with them,they had Jews working in the Vatican by the way,and its now been acknowledged by some Jewish leaders that the Pope of the time helped save the lives of thousands of Jews,but much of that at the time had to be done in secret.

[Chris_Sleeps]

The Vatican had to pretend to be in league with them,they had Jews working in the Vatican by the way

The Italian Fascist Party had Jewish members, because Italy wasn't strongly antisemitic until Hitler forced the issue. How did Jewish Vatican staff fare when that happened? The Pope renounced collecting them up and sending them off, did he? I'll give you the answer - no. No, he didn't.

its now been acknowledged by some Jewish leaders that the Pope of the time helped save the lives of thousands of Jews

Which Jewish leaders?

 

The actions of the Catholic Church during WW2 are hotly contended. People who write books on the issue change their minds decades later, in both condemning and cleansing the Church. It's a very complex piece of history, not helped in the most part by the Catholic Church restricting access to its own archives.

 

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So why was religion stamped upon and the Jews driven out of the USSR?

Russian antisemitism is another source of fascism, or so it can be argued. The Tsarist reign ran the pogroms, and The White Army (the Russian Royalists) were more brutal towards Jews than the USSR ever were. European communism was full of Jews.

[Mecky]

Every country is the world is capitalist. Don't confuse monetry systems with political systems.