harvey19 Posted March 14, 2013 Share Posted March 14, 2013 Mister M replied earlier saying they lived on the outskirts of such an area..and they have far from a hostile view towards immigrants. I've also lived in areas with high numbers of new immigrants (Nether Edge, Broomhall, Firvale). To spin your post back to you, there's no indication as yet that those with a hostile view live in these areas either. Mister M was the only poster to reply. What interested me was whether other posters were posting from experience or idealised/theoretical viewpoints. Thankyou for explaining that you spoke from experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyfriday Posted March 14, 2013 Share Posted March 14, 2013 Mister M was the only poster to reply. What interested me was whether other posters were posting from experience or idealised/theoretical viewpoints. I guess those with a hostile view are perfectly entitled to hold those views whether they live in the inner city or not-it's unlikely living in Darnall and finding their new Muslim neighbour from Bosnia was a warm, generous former teacher would placate them. On the other hand those of us with a 'take people as we find them view', don't need to live in the inner city for that view to always be pre-eminent. If I live in Darnall and all my neighbours are tossers I won't like them...whether they be immigrants or not, there's no need to generalise about whole communities of people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retep Posted March 14, 2013 Share Posted March 14, 2013 I notice you neglected to mention a few key items from the article. Not only are MigrationWatch's maths a little suspect their clear agenda and fondness for negative spin led the Home Affairs Committee stated "You chose to present your statistics in the most sensational and pejorative way." Hardly objective. Now, the personnel - David Coleman - asked, in 2003, what the cultural benefits of migration were, he replied that they were "rather difficult to specify beyond a wider range of ethnic restaurants for the middle classes and new kinds of pop music for youth" Sir Andrew Green - the Home affairs Committe compared him to the mentally disturbed Lieutenant Commander Philip F Queeg in the 1954 classic, The Caine Mutiny and accused him of being negative, obsessive and paranoid in his views about immigration. Baroness Cox - argues that Palestinians don't really want, and certainly don't deserve, a state and that the way to deal with the problem is to give $100,000 to each family to make them go away and settle permanently elsewhere in the Arab Muslim world. James Duguid - believes the UK's population should be reduced by half, to its 1881 level of 30m, over the next 100 years by discouraging teenage pregancies, cutting financial support for families with more than two children and adopting MWUK's and UKIP's policies of zero migration growth. I think it is fair to say that the article tells us a lot more about MigrationWatch than, as you suggest, someone missed a 0 or miscalculated by 10pence. It tells us that their objectivity and impartiality is questionable and that, therefore, their credibility is severely diminished. To stand in MigrationWatch's glass house and hurl stones at the University of Sheffield is laughable. So after all that bluster you come up with nothing but trying to discredit a couple of blokes from migrationwatch to try and reinforce your stance. The university's are only trying to protect their golden goose, can't blame them for trying, somebody has to pay their wages. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alchresearch Posted March 14, 2013 Share Posted March 14, 2013 Just on the flip side of all this, I live in an area which over the past few years have got more trendy and arty. Expensive posh restaurants and bars, delis & wine merchants and even a gallery have sprung up and the more traditional shops gone. Since the pub stopped selling real ale and just sells posh continental lager I've stopped going, but the new crowd who've moved into the area are happy with it. So it could be said that it can happen in all walks of life. Things and areas change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyfriday Posted March 14, 2013 Share Posted March 14, 2013 The university's are only trying to protect their golden goose, can't blame them for trying, somebody has to pay their wages. Read the article retep. Sheffield University commissioned independent research by Oxford Economics a commercial venture of Oxford University's Business School, this wasn't some tinpot study created by people with an agenda. Oxford Economics was founded in 1981 as a commercial venture with Oxford University’s business college to provide economic forecasting and modelling to UK companies and financial institutions expanding abroad. Since then, we have become one of the world’s foremost independent global advisory firms, providing reports, forecasts and analytical tools on 190 countries, 100 industrial sectors and over 2,600 cities. Our best-of-class global economic and industry models and analytical tools give us an unparalleled ability to forecast external market trends and assess their economic, social and business impact. http://www.oxfordeconomics.com/about-us Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harvey19 Posted March 14, 2013 Share Posted March 14, 2013 I guess those with a hostile view are perfectly entitled to hold those views whether they live in the inner city or not-it's unlikely living in Darnall and finding their new Muslim neighbour from Bosnia was a warm, generous former teacher would placate them. On the other hand those of us with a 'take people as we find them view', don't need to live in the inner city for that view to always be pre-eminent. If I live in Darnall and all my neighbours are tossers I won't like them...whether they be immigrants or not, there's no need to generalise about whole communities of people. What prompted me to ask the question was an episode of Question Time several weeks ago when a similar subject was being debated. One of the panelist, a Cambridge professor quoted a report which stated there was no problem with immigrants and the number of them in the area(Lincolnshire). An articulate member of the audience spoke from her and others in the areas experiences which was entirely different to the reports conclusions and which the professor was relying on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyfriday Posted March 14, 2013 Share Posted March 14, 2013 What prompted me to ask the question was an episode of Question Time several weeks ago when a similar subject was being debated. One of the panelist, a Cambridge professor quoted a report which stated there was no problem with immigrants and the number of them in the area(Lincolnshire). An articulate member of the audience spoke from her and others in the areas experiences which was entirely different to the reports conclusions and which the professor was relying on. I think you missed my point harvey, I'm not denying indigenous members of the population who live in high density immigration areas have issues with immigrants-they're perfectly entitled to. What I'm saying is are those issues based on xenophobia-having a dislike of foreigners or is it about individuals or is it over more measurable factors like the strain on healthcare, education, the police etc? The Cambridge professor was probably alluding to the latter in terms of Lincolnshire, but without having seen the programme or the report he was relying on I can only speculate about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harvey19 Posted March 14, 2013 Share Posted March 14, 2013 I think you missed my point harvey, I'm not denying indigenous members of the population who live in high density immigration areas have issues with immigrants-they're perfectly entitled to. What I'm saying is are those issues based on xenophobia-having a dislike of foreigners or is it about individuals or is it over more measurable factors like the strain on healthcare, education, the police etc? The Cambridge professor was probably alluding to the latter in terms of Lincolnshire, but without having seen the programme or the report he was relying on I can only speculate about it. Much of the disagreement centred around healthcare, jobs, accomadation and such. The important point I am trying to make by my initial post is that theory/idealism should not overrule the experiences of those affected when discussing this and other subjects. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyfriday Posted March 14, 2013 Share Posted March 14, 2013 The important point I am trying to make by my initial post is that theory/idealism should not overrule the experiences of those affected when discussing this and other subjects. I agree, and of course what's equally valid are the views of those foreigners who are just trying to get on with their lives who face gratuitous hostility from the native community, wouldn't you agree? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinfoilhat Posted March 14, 2013 Share Posted March 14, 2013 I agree, and of course what's equally valid are the views of those foreigners who are just trying to get on with their lives who face gratuitous hostility from the native community, wouldn't you agree? Valid ? Definately. Equally valid ? Actually, no, well not in my opinion anyway. Surely those in first should get "first dibs" on any issues likely to cause conflicts unless it's cross-burning or something obviously offensive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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