Lord Ahmed the criminal, convicted killer and now Antisemit!

[Baz1]

(3:67) Abraham was neither a Jew nor a Christian; he was a Muslim, (one who submitted to God) مَا كَانَ اِبۡرٰهِيۡمُ يَهُوۡدِيًّا وَّلَا نَصۡرَانِيًّا وَّ لٰكِنۡ كَانَ حَنِيۡفًا مُّسۡلِمًا ؕ وَمَا كَانَ مِنَ

 

Some confusion here with some people- a Muslim is one who submits to God, even if he/she was amongst the people of the Book (as the Qu'ran refers to those who received revelation). The red bold reads he (Abraham) was a Muslim who submitted to God.

 

The definition from FlammingJimmy was not entirely correct as Muslims existed before Muhammad- but there are articles of faith that could take a person out of the fold of Islam, if some of these were rejected (denying some or all of God's attributes, rejecting some of the Prophets etc).

 

Some scholars do and can give rulings as to what may take a person out of the fold of Islam but it is not done lightly- usually people will leave this as something that only God truly knows (the persons intention etc).

 

In regards to the OP- Lord Ahmed is a Muslim as far as I am aware. However that does not mean one cannot be critical of him for making such allegations.

 

Followers of Islam are not infallible- they can and do wrong just like anyone else. There are some who commit terror and others who do all sorts of things that Islam condemns or warns against (lying, cheating, stealing etc).

 

That can be said for other faiths- even Pali Richard will agree some followers of Buddha have committed wrongs that go against Buddhism. Pali R has given some good accounts of Islam and his understanding of Muslims is appreciated.

 

Ultimately the position of Islam is that wrong doers who although were 'Muslim' (or maintained they were) will face Judgement for their actions where they wronged others or committed any acts that Islam forbids.

 

Sorry for the long post- don't come on SF a lot nowadays but this OP caught my eye.

[PaliRichard]

That can be said for other faiths- even Pali Richard will agree some followers of Buddha have committed wrongs that go against Buddhism[/Quote]

 

I do agree. I'm not sure 'go against Buddhism' is entirely correct but without getting complex you are right, there are people who claim to be followers of Buddha who do not live in line with the teachings he gave.

 

Pali R has given some good accounts of Islam and his understanding of Muslims is appreciated

 

Thankyou, the appreciation is in turn appreciated.

[flamingjimmy]

(3:67) Abraham was neither a Jew nor a Christian; he was a Muslim, (one who submitted to God) مَا كَانَ اِبۡرٰهِيۡمُ يَهُوۡدِيًّا وَّلَا نَصۡرَانِيًّا وَّ لٰكِنۡ كَانَ حَنِيۡفًا مُّسۡلِمًا ؕ وَمَا كَانَ مِنَ

 

Some confusion here with some people- a Muslim is one who submits to God, even if he/she was amongst the people of the Book (as the Qu'ran refers to those who received revelation). The red bold reads he (Abraham) was a Muslim who submitted to God.

 

The definition from FlammingJimmy was not entirely correct as Muslims existed before Muhammad- but there are articles of faith that could take a person out of the fold of Islam, if some of these were rejected (denying some or all of God's attributes, rejecting some of the Prophets etc).

 

Some scholars do and can give rulings as to what may take a person out of the fold of Islam but it is not done lightly- usually people will leave this as something that only God truly knows (the persons intention etc).

 

In regards to the OP- Lord Ahmed is a Muslim as far as I am aware. However that does not mean one cannot be critical of him for making such allegations.

 

Followers of Islam are not infallible- they can and do wrong just like anyone else. There are some who commit terror and others who do all sorts of things that Islam condemns or warns against (lying, cheating, stealing etc).

 

That can be said for other faiths- even Pali Richard will agree some followers of Buddha have committed wrongs that go against Buddhism. Pali R has given some good accounts of Islam and his understanding of Muslims is appreciated.

 

Ultimately the position of Islam is that wrong doers who although were 'Muslim' (or maintained they were) will face Judgement for their actions where they wronged others or committed any acts that Islam forbids.

 

Sorry for the long post- don't come on SF a lot nowadays but this OP caught my eye.

 

Come on now Muslim may originally have meant 'one who submits to god' and by the definition you can pull tricks like imply that Abraham's religion was similar to your own, however the word Muslim has come to mean 'one who follows Islam'. It is the equivalent of Christian or Bhuddist or Hindu etc. in that sense. There is no other word for followers of Islam, I'm not going to start typing things like 'antisemitism exists amongst those who follow Islam' because that is unwieldy. I will continue to say things like 'antisemitism exists amongst Muslims'.

 

As a Muslim, sorry, as a follower of Islam (I can't possibly be sure that you are a true Muslim by PaliRichard's standard) are you willing to concede perhaps that some Muslims are antisemetic, and that being antisemitic does not disqualify one from being a Muslim?

[GrapeApe]

Did you not know its alright for a Muslim to be Anti semitic but god forbid you make an anti Muslim comment on this forum. The truth is out there, you just need to lift a few stones and confront the lies.

 

You're joking right? this forum is full of anti Muslim bigots posting their hateful filth. You don't need to look far

[gnvqsos]

It is funny how a lot of people tolerate anti-Semitism until this is perpetrated by a muslim.

[SevenRivers]

You're joking right? this forum is full of anti Muslim bigots posting their hateful filth. You don't need to look far

 

I think a lot of people have a problem with Islam, and the behaviours of some Muslims attritutable to their faith. Don't confuse it with being against all Muslims.

[Halibut]

I think a lot of people have a problem with Islam, and the behaviours of some Muslims attritutable to their faith. Don't confuse it with being against all Muslims.

 

He's not the one doing that - it's the knuckle dragging boneheads on here that do that.

[LeMaquis]

There's an article about Ahmed in Searchlight over his links with anti-semites on the far right. Why the Labour Party hasn't expelled him for his links to these people maybe they'd like to explain.

 

http://searchlightmagazine.com/blogs/searchlight-blog/lord-ahmed-and-antisemitism

[cuttsie]

That's because at the time of the driving offence Mr Huhne was transformed into Ms Pryce.

While driving ! No wonder he was speeding it only takes a minute.

To get caught that is.

[callippo]

There's an article about Ahmed in Searchlight over his links with anti-semites on the far right. Why the Labour Party hasn't expelled him for his links to these people maybe they'd like to explain.

 

http://searchlightmagazine.com/blogs/searchlight-blog/lord-ahmed-and-antisemitism

 

notice how Searchlight take the trouble to spell the word antisemitism correctly, without a hyphen (the original German word antisemitish is never spelt with any hyphen). Spelling it with a hyphen gives rise to a misconception that it has anything to with Semite or Semites when the word antisemitisch or antisemite has never meant anything other than hating Jews.