Is it morally wrong to claim unemployment benefit if you have savings?

[gnvqsos]

The top 10% of earners in the country pay 50% of the tax revenue to the government.

 

So rather than not paying much, they in fact pay the vast majority of tax.

 

---------- Post added 31-03-2013 at 10:31 ----------

 

 

What about if they converted that asset into other forms? The car for example? Or fine wine?

 

It seems counter intuitive to only consider assets held as cash for the purpose of reducing benefits.

 

The top 10pc only pay half of INCOME TAX-how much VAT etc. they pay is unrecorded and therefore a matter of speculation.I think you are cutting more corners,MrC:hihi:

[I1L2T3]

What about if they converted that asset into other forms? The car for example? Or fine wine?

 

It seems counter intuitive to only consider assets held as cash for the purpose of reducing benefits.

 

Interesting point. I guess it depends on the liquidity of the asset. Cash has liquidity. The other assets potentially do not.

 

Some people would argue that fine wine investment is in a bubble anyway.

 

A new car depreciates in value as soon as it's driven off the forecourt. Not a great investment. Unless it's a classic car.

 

I'm not sure what the rules are on investments and claiming JSA though. Somebody else might.

[gnvqsos]

Interesting point. I guess it depends on the liquidity of the asset. Cash has liquidity. The other assets potentially do not.

 

Some people would argue that fine wine investment is in a bubble anyway.

 

A new car depreciates in value as soon as it's driven off the forecourt. Not a great investment. Unless it's a classic car.

 

I'm not sure what the rules are on investments and claiming JSA though. Somebody else might.

 

There was a bubble in Brut and Champagne section of fine wines last year.

[Cyclone]

Interesting point. I guess it depends on the liquidity of the asset. Cash has liquidity. The other assets potentially do not.

 

Some people would argue that fine wine investment is in a bubble anyway.

 

A new car depreciates in value as soon as it's driven off the forecourt. Not a great investment. Unless it's a classic car.

 

I'm not sure what the rules are on investments and claiming JSA though. Somebody else might.

 

I'm not sure that whether an asset is appreciating or not is relevant, a car is still an asset and has x value at any given time. It could be converted into cash by selling it privately, probably quite quickly.

Assets aren't all investments of course, but they do all have value.

 

---------- Post added 31-03-2013 at 11:48 ----------

 

The top 10pc only pay half of INCOME TAX-how much VAT etc. they pay is unrecorded and therefore a matter of speculation.I think you are cutting more corners,MrC:hihi:

 

I was only considering income tax.

 

Interesting point re:VAT and other indirect taxes. Presumably even after they've paid 50% of the national income tax takings they still have more money than those who earn less, and whilst I'm sure they save quite a lot of it, they also presumably spend quite a lot of it.

Given that VAT isn't applied to basic items and is applied to luxury items, of which they are likely to buy more (due to having higher discretionary disposable income) they almost certainly account for a greater % of the VAT income than lower earners.

I'd guess though that if you included all indirect taxes their % contribution would fall from the income tax headline of 50% contribution, to some lower amount, for example "the top 1% contribute 25% of the total non corporation tax contributions" (only an example, not even speculating that it might be correct).

[gnvqsos]

I'm not sure that whether an asset is appreciating or not is relevant, a car is still an asset and has x value at any given time. It could be converted into cash by selling it privately, probably quite quickly.

Assets aren't all investments of course, but they do all have value.

 

In law any marketable asset can be construed as an investment,unless it is subject to depreciation which exceeds any appreciation in value.

 

---------- Post added 31-03-2013 at 10:52 ----------

 

I'm not sure that whether an asset is appreciating or not is relevant, a car is still an asset and has x value at any given time. It could be converted into cash by selling it privately, probably quite quickly.

Assets aren't all investments of course, but they do all have value.

 

---------- Post added 31-03-2013 at 11:48 ----------

 

 

I was only considering income tax.

 

Interesting point re:VAT and other indirect taxes. Presumably even after they've paid 50% of the national income tax takings they still have more money than those who earn less, and whilst I'm sure they save quite a lot of it, they also presumably spend quite a lot of it.

Given that VAT isn't applied to basic items and is applied to luxury items, of which they are likely to buy more (due to having higher discretionary disposable income) they almost certainly account for a greater % of the VAT income than lower earners.

I'd guess though that if you included all indirect taxes their % contribution would fall from the income tax headline of 50% contribution, to some lower amount, for example "the top 1% contribute 25% of the total non corporation tax contributions" (only an example, not even speculating that it might be correct).

 

Why, having erred with the tax issue,do you continue to wade into areas of controversy?VAT is added to basics such as energy used,many foodstuffs,home repairs,and many medical services.

[carosio]

In law any marketable asset can be construed as an investment,unless it is subject to depreciation which exceeds any appreciation in value.[color="Silver"

 

According to their website, the DWP does not take into account cars, furniture, personal possessions as capital assets. So, buy a Rolls, some nice 17th century silverware, a couple of Turners, a French mantle clock (all in good time, of course) then you won't have to declare them when you claim!

[cookingfat50]

I don't know the limits on savings but let's say you have 3 grand tucked away.

 

no it's not wrong to have saving and claim benefit after all it's not a big lottery win is it but it may have taken along time for you to save that amount i have a couple of hundred thats all for household repairs. but as for your savings its not a fortune but you have saved it out of your hard earned money if anyone asked i would deny having any even if if it meant spending every peny even if i had to buy 3,000 lottery tickets to prove i had nowt , but as i know you can have up to £16,000 thousand without any having your amount for reassurance you could ring the benefits office who would tell you for sure how much you can have. that comes from a very good sourse my wife who dealt with benefits for years so sleep well even with your money tucked under the mattress

[Cyclone]

In law any marketable asset can be construed as an investment,unless it is subject to depreciation which exceeds any appreciation in value.

Which is exactly why I said that not all assets are investments.

A car is an asset, but with a few exceptions, it's a depreciating one.

 

Why, having erred with the tax issue,do you continue to wade into areas of controversy?VAT is added to basics such as energy used,many foodstuffs,home repairs,and many medical services.

 

Why do you object to exploring an area of the topic that you brought up?

Medical services in the UK are generally provided by the NHS for a nominal cost or for free. Which medical services have VAT added to them?

That's purely out of interest, I'm not really interested in whether you want to argue that VAT is targeted at luxury items, that's the intent of it, and it's irrelevant for the brief analysis of whether the highly paid contribute more through paying VAT than the low paid.

[gnvqsos]

According to their website, the DWP does not take into account cars, furniture, personal possessions as capital assets. So, buy a Rolls, some nice 17th century silverware, a couple of Turners, a French mantle clock (all in good time, of course) then you won't have to declare them when you claim!

 

The rules of the DWP are not laws,but thanks for the tips about holding ones assets.I let my wife hold my assets for tax reasons.

 

---------- Post added 01-04-2013 at 09:34 ----------

 

Which is exactly why I said that not all assets are investments.

A car is an asset, but with a few exceptions, it's a depreciating one.

 

Why do you object to exploring an area of the topic that you brought up?

Medical services in the UK are generally provided by the NHS for a nominal cost or for free. Which medical services have VAT added to them?

That's purely out of interest, I'm not really interested in whether you want to argue that VAT is targeted at luxury items, that's the intent of it, and it's irrelevant for the brief analysis of whether the highly paid contribute more through paying VAT than the low paid.

 

Private medical services and dental fees carry VAT,as do opticians work.

[Cyclone]

Private medical and dental services in a country with a national health service would correctly be categorised as a luxury.

Opticians is an odd one isn't it, very few people qualify for NHS glasses, so the basic eye test and correctional lenses or contacts should really be VAT free.