Does God Exist?

[redwhine]

You need to read the above posts.

 

"And there has never been a claim that humans come from apes" - http://www.watch-documentaries-online.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/03/article-0-02EC002200000578-483_468x326.jpg

That is a cartoon and makes no claim.

 

Human beings and apes share a common ancestor. They are not interchangable.

[[Matt]]

Climb Mt. Everest without oxygen, swim to the bottom of the Pacific Ocean, walk across the Gobi or Kalahari deserts, then get back to me on how perfect the Earth is for us to live in. (If you can avoid all the sharks, lions, etc. that would try to eat you, snakes and insects which would poison you and bacteria which would infect you, that is.) Not to mention the earthquakes, tsunamis etc. Oh and did you know the Andromeda Galaxy is on a collision course with our own Milky Way, or that the Sun will burn out in a few billion years.

You neglect to mention that the vast majority of the universe is so filled with harmful radiation and inhospitable extremes of temperature that 98% of its space would kill you instantly.

 

Yes of course this universe was designed with us in mind!!!!

Edited July 13, 2010 by [Matt]

[flamingjimmy]

As bad as I think propaganda, power, subjugation and control can be in society I do still appreciate that social unification, morality and abstract thinking are some of the beneficial side effects we've had from a belief in the spirit world.

 

Indeed, and do you have any reason to believe that other than a hunch?

[Cavegirl]

That is a cartoon and makes no claim.

 

Human beings and apes share a common ancestor. They are not interchangable.

 

I think this point needs clarifying. We class gorilla's, chimpanzees, orangutans etc as apes. We class ourselves as great apes. Of the apes our closest living genetic relative is the chimpanzee (specifically the bonobo) with whom we share between 95-99% of our DNA (depending upon which study you take to be most accurate).

 

It's probably better to use the scientific Linnean classifications and say we're all primates in the hominidae family rather than use the term ape.

 

Humans:

 

Kingdom: Animalia

Phylum: Chordata

Class: Mammalia

Order: Primates

Family: Hominidae

Genus: Homo

Species: sapiens

 

Chimpanzee:

 

KINGDOM: Animalia

PHYLUM: Chordata

CLASS: Mammalia

ORDER: Primates

FAMILY: Hominidae

GENUS: Pan

SPECIES: Troglodytes

 

This is the best diagram I have found to illustrate the shared evolutionary trees of the hominidae-

 

http://www-tc.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/teachers/activities/images/3416_id_02_chart.gif

 

The human part then looks something like this-

 

http://www.globalchange.umich.edu/gctext/Inquiries/Inquiries_by_Unit/Unit_5_files/image017.jpg

[Cavegirl]

Indeed, and do you have any reason to believe that other than a hunch?

 

How about 10 years of academic study?

 

And the fact that I'd previously stated this:-

 

Just for the sake of an interesting discussion I'd like to raise a point. I wonder whether our long history of religious belief doesn't actually inform science. I'm not sure yet whether a belief in the spirit world, from the most ancient times, hasn't been the most significant aspect of our development that has led to our ability to use abstract thinking.

Edited July 13, 2010 by Cavegirl

[truman]

How about 10 years of academic study?

 

Were you trying to say that religion has given us social unification?

[flamingjimmy]

How about 10 years of academic study?

 

Academic study into what?

 

What could you possibly study that makes this:

 

'social unification, morality and abstract thinking are some of the beneficial side effects we've had from a belief in the spirit world.'

 

anything other than a hunch based opinion?

[Cavegirl]

Were you trying to say that religion has given us social unification?

 

My original post said this-

 

I think there's a value to this approach for a society that is purely surviving, like a hunter-gatherer society. It offers morale and can unite individuals into a co-operative group, so I understand why it developed.

[flamingjimmy]

And the fact that I'd previously stated this:-

 

"Just for the sake of an interesting discussion I'd like to raise a point. I wonder whether our long history of religious belief doesn't actually inform science. I'm not sure yet whether a belief in the spirit world, from the most ancient times, hasn't been the most significant aspect of our development that has led to our ability to use abstract thinking."

 

That to me, reads as "I have a hunch that our ability to use abstract thinking is a result of spiritual beliefs"

 

There is still nothing other than a hunch to back it up.

[truman]

My original post said this-

 

I was thinking more of this...

 

"As bad as I think propaganda, power, subjugation and control can be in society I do still appreciate that social unification, morality and abstract thinking are some of the beneficial side effects we've had from a belief in the spirit world."

 

I can't for the life of me see how morality and social unification are part of religion......they all appear to be lacking in both...