frededwards Posted May 14, 2013 Share Posted May 14, 2013 With that in mind, How do you judge the shiniest of two turds? That brings this quote to mind..... "Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waldo Posted May 14, 2013 Author Share Posted May 14, 2013 I'm not bothered about the moral high ground. I'm bothered about stopping them killing innocent people. If there has to be collateral damage and some civilian casualties over there, so be it. I don't want them killing innocent people either. Innocent people in Pakistan are just as much human beings as innocent people in the US and UK or anywhere else for that matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frededwards Posted May 14, 2013 Share Posted May 14, 2013 The difference being that people in the UK or the US would not tolerate, or at least fail to inform the authorities about, terrorists operating in their midst. (With a few exceptions in Dewsbury, Birmingham etc., obviously). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinfoilhat Posted May 14, 2013 Share Posted May 14, 2013 Nope. They wouldn't... Because it would involve an awareness and acceptance of their own culpability, how they've contributed to creating (no matter how small that contribution may be) an environment where human beings feel justified in committing terrorist acts. I think it's probably quite simplistic to think that human beings suddenly wake up and decide to become 'terrorists' for no reason. Why are 'they' attacking 'us'? Are there elements within our society who stand to profit though conflict (and who cares if a few fellow civilians are killed in the comeback)? Just saying, maybe it's a good idea to understand the wider context.. Yes. Very. There is a wider context. I'll wager it's Americas "influence" in the middle east - be that in the form of Saudi air bases or selling weapons and defending Israel to the hilt. Pre 911 America was generally preoccupied with the former Yugoslavia and what Clinton was doing with his winkle. The middle east was relatively settled. Now look at it. If there was no 911 we wouldn't have half the problems we have now. Bin laden and his small band started it, the taliban happily let them stay and the rest is history. But America didn't have any other choice did it - the scale of it all was too big not to respond. Yes it could have modified it's policies, which to a degree it's done under Obama but I can't think of any American president who wouldn't have chased after bin laden. If not, how many attacks of that scale would provoke a response? Another one? Two? And if America had caved - then what? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Waldo Posted May 14, 2013 Author Share Posted May 14, 2013 If there was no 911 we wouldn't have half the problems we have now. Bin laden and his small band started it, the taliban happily let them stay and the rest is history. But America didn't have any other choice did it - the scale of it all was too big not to respond. Yes it could have modified it's policies, which to a degree it's done under Obama but I can't think of any American president who wouldn't have chased after bin laden. If not, how many attacks of that scale would provoke a response? Another one? Two? And if America had caved - then what? I quite like Obama; he strikes me as a decent human being with integrity (not at all like Bush). Maybe I've been taken in by his excellent presentation and oratory skills though. Anyhow, to answer your question; yes, I think it was the right thing to respond to 911. I also think it's the right thing to behave more ethically in the first place; and also where military action is required, to not kill innocent people (if that isn't possible, find some other way to attack the enemy). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Islam4me2 Posted May 14, 2013 Share Posted May 14, 2013 how many children have these drones killed? any one lsit them? ---------- Post added 14-05-2013 at 15:47 ---------- PAKISTAN Name | Age | Gender Noor Aziz | 8 | male Abdul Wasit | 17 | male Noor Syed | 8 | male Wajid Noor | 9 | male Syed Wali Shah | 7 | male Ayeesha | 3 | female Qari Alamzeb | 14| male Shoaib | 8 | male Hayatullah KhaMohammad | 16 | male Tariq Aziz | 16 | male Sanaullah Jan | 17 | male Maezol Khan | 8 | female Nasir Khan | male Naeem Khan | male Naeemullah | male Mohammad Tahir | 16 | male short example see some of the full list here: http://earthfirstnews.wordpress.com/2013/04/15/the-boston-marathon-and-u-s-drone-attacks-a-tale-of-two-terrorisms/ ---------- Post added 14-05-2013 at 15:48 ---------- YEMEN Afrah Ali Mohammed Nasser | 9 | female Hoda Ali Mohammed Nasser | 5 | female Sheikha Ali Mohammed Nasser | 4 | female Salma Abdullah Mokbel Salem Louqye | 4 | female Fatima Abdullah Mokbel Salem Louqye | 3 | female Khadije Ali Mokbel Louqye | 1 | female Hanaa Ali Mokbel Louqye | 6 | female Mohammed Ali Mokbel Salem Louqye | 4 | male Maryam Hussein Abdullah Awad | 2 | female Shafiq Hussein Abdullah Awad | 1 | female Shafika Mohammed Saleh Mohammed | 4 | female Shafiq Mohammed Saleh Mohammed | 2 | male short list here , Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frededwards Posted May 14, 2013 Share Posted May 14, 2013 There's a very long list of victims here, all of them killed on one day. http://www.newsday.com/911-anniversary/list-of-sept-11-victims-1.3161056 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vague_Boy Posted May 14, 2013 Share Posted May 14, 2013 The fact is, the drones are attacking the very same people the Pakistan military are attacking, most of the time. You mean their own civiliians? US drones kill up to 80% civilians – Pakistan Interior Minister Hmmm... that must be why the United Nations declared that the US drone program was a war crime: UN Official: Aspects Of US Drone Program Clearly 'War Crimes' And the Peshawar High Court US drone strikes a war crime Pakistan court rules US drone strikes as illegal 'war crimes' Drone strikes threaten 50 years of international law, says UN rapporteur It's amazing the lengths some people will go to to justify murder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buck Posted May 14, 2013 Share Posted May 14, 2013 There's a very long list of victims here, all of them killed on one day. http://www.newsday.com/911-anniversary/list-of-sept-11-victims-1.3161056 All of them innocent and just as dead as those poor kids, except the kids weren't killed deliberately, the ones in the towers were. I don't think the list includes the airline passengers nor the people at the Pentagon. that list is bigger than 7/7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Islam4me2 Posted May 14, 2013 Share Posted May 14, 2013 There's a very long list of victims here, all of them killed on one day. http://www.newsday.com/911-anniversary/list-of-sept-11-victims-1.3161056 western wars have killed a hundred fold more than the so called terror atacks of 9-11. isnt that true? bloody hell even wihout wars half a million iraq kids were killed due to sanction. come on In the USA your more likly to be killed by a cop than a terror attack i think allergies and bee stings kill more people biggest killer is Mcds and KFC food, ( hear disease ) lets put things into perspective shall we no one from the drone bombing areas has been involved in 911 now were they. were they fred?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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