El Cid Posted June 15, 2013 Share Posted June 15, 2013 If you just try to find the best way to live, by contemplation and discussion, perhaps making reference to a few wise dudes that came before you, but without recourse to the supernatural, then that is philosophy, not religion. Like Margaret Thatcher or Adolf Hitler? I dont believe in God, but what/who is the alternative? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RootsBooster Posted June 15, 2013 Author Share Posted June 15, 2013 Like Margaret Thatcher or Adolf Hitler? I dont believe in God, but what/who is the alternative? What makes you think there needs to be an alternative? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flamingjimmy Posted June 15, 2013 Share Posted June 15, 2013 That's better That's all any word is, what it means to people. I think it cannot be divorced from concepts like the divine, sacredness and the supernatural. You apparently don't. This being the case can you give me an example of a religious statement or act that has nothing to do with those things? ---------- Post added 15-06-2013 at 13:40 ---------- Like Margaret Thatcher or Adolf Hitler? You may revere them as 'wise dudes that came before you', I do not, and would judge you harshly if you did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Cid Posted June 15, 2013 Share Posted June 15, 2013 What makes you think there needs to be an alternative? Because the churches are the places that hold sessions for the Guides, Brownies, Cubs, Scouts and Rainbows, and the numbers of religous people is declining ---------- Post added 15-06-2013 at 13:43 ---------- You may revere them as 'wise dudes that came before you', I do not, and would judge you harshly if you did. Me neither, but I do struggle for figures to "revere". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RootsBooster Posted June 15, 2013 Author Share Posted June 15, 2013 Because the churches are the places that hold sessions for the Guides, Brownies, Cubs, Scouts and Rainbows, and the numbers of religous people is declining These groups also meet in places that aren't Churches. This is why you think there needs to be an alternative to God? ---------- Post added 15-06-2013 at 14:08 ---------- That's all any word is, what it means to people. I think it cannot be divorced from concepts like the divine, sacredness and the supernatural. You apparently don't. I haven't said anything about divinity, sacredness or the supernatural. All I said is that you don't have to believe in a god to be religious. This being the case can you give me an example of a religious statement or act that has nothing to do with those things? Not without spending some time (which I have little of, lately) looking into it. A quick google brings up some gubbins, I might get back to your request later if I can. EDIT: Can you show me anything that says If a religion doesn't worship a god it's not a religion? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Cid Posted June 15, 2013 Share Posted June 15, 2013 This is why you think there needs to be an alternative to God?? The alternative, at the moment, seems to be consumerism/capitalism; I think that is just as bad as religion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RootsBooster Posted June 15, 2013 Author Share Posted June 15, 2013 The alternative, at the moment, seems to be consumerism/capitalism; I think that is just as bad as religion. I think you are somewhat confused Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyclone Posted June 16, 2013 Share Posted June 16, 2013 Religions such as Buddhism, Scientology, Jainism and even Quakers (to name a few) can all be without gods Buddhism doesn't subscribe to a maker diety, but it is not without belief in gods, if anything it's polytheistic. Theravadin Buddhists think that personal effort is required to realize rebirth. Meditation is done by forest monks for the most part, while village monks teach and serve their lay communities. Laypersons can perform good actions, producing merit that can be traded to the gods who may reward it with material benefits. Scientology is a cult. I had to look up Jainism, not dissimilar to Buddhism though. Jainism offers an elaborate cosmology, including heavenly beings (devas), but these beings are not viewed as creators; they are subject to suffering and change like all other living beings, and must eventually die. Quakers appear to believe in an Abrahamic God... Shintoism might have been another good counter. But that turns out to be polytheistic. Not having a belief in a single creator god doesn't mean a religion doesn't include a belief in gods and more generally in the supernatural in some form. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RootsBooster Posted June 16, 2013 Author Share Posted June 16, 2013 Buddhism doesn't subscribe to a maker diety, but it is not without belief in gods, if anything it's polytheistic. Some Buddhists may believe in gods, but as far as I'm aware, many don't. I have never read anything about the religion's doctrines including anything about having to believe in any gods. Can you name any of these gods? Or are you actually referring to the Devas? Scientology is a cult. Most religions are cults! Definition of cult noun -1 a system of religious veneration and devotion directed towards a particular figure or object: the cult of St Olaf -a relatively small group of people having religious beliefs or practices regarded by others as strange or as imposing excessive control over members: a network of Satan-worshipping cults -a misplaced or excessive admiration for a particular thing: the cult of the pursuit of money as an end in itself -2 a person or thing that is popular or fashionable among a particular group or section of society: the series has become a bit of a cult in the UK aside from that, it's recognised as a religion in the UK in the Census (which isn't saying much, Jedi is also listed there) and the Royal Navy, to name two examples. It's formally recognised as a religion by the U.S. Government. It also fits definitions of a religion... Definition of religion noun -[mass noun] the belief in and worship of a superhuman controlling power, especially a personal God or gods: ideas about the relationship between science and religion -[count noun] a particular system of faith and worship: the world’s great religions -[count noun] a pursuit or interest followed with great devotion: consumerism is the new religion I had to look up Jainism, not dissimilar to Buddhism though. That's not really an argument, is it. Do you think they (as a requirement of their religion) believe in any gods? If so, which? Quakers appear to believe in an Abrahamic God... Shintoism might have been another good counter. But that turns out to be polytheistic. Yes, theist Quakers do indeed believe in God. It's the atheist or nontheist (same thing) Quakers which don't. Not having a belief in a single creator god doesn't mean a religion doesn't include a belief in gods and more generally in the supernatural in some form. and neither does it mean it does include a belief in gods and more generally in the supernatural in some form. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Earthly Posted June 16, 2013 Share Posted June 16, 2013 Why a false trichotomy? ---------- Post added 02-06-2013 at 01:57 ---------- Reality check unnecessary, it's just a hypothetical scenario Thanks for the hostility Strange how your outburst seems to imply you aren't either side of the coin No, it explains clearly in the OP why I mention the Bible. You should try reading it fully (the OP) Starting threads to have a go at religion and religious people. Tell us again how you're above petty religious arguments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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