Is Sheffield Council about to sell off bits of Graves Park YET AGAIN?

[WallBuilder]

I have no recollection of a toilet block there. Are you thinking of the bottom end of Cobnar Road?

 

It was there a stone built structure, very basic, men on one side women on the other. If you go past the dense patch of evergreen shrubbery and look closely you can still see the two bits of tarmac pathing that led to the rrespective entrances.

[Tallgrass]

This whole discussion just demonstrates the total ignorance of the level of cuts being faced by the council, and it wouldn't matter who was in power, these cuts are being imposed by central government.

 

Now if the council had spent thousands over the years (or should that be the trust actually?) maintaining an empty building people would have all been complaining too. We already have loads of under-used community buildings in Sheffield.

 

Don't get me wrong - I don't want to see it being sold off either but parks don't have the money or staff to maintain the grass, hedges, dog bins, beds, fly-tipping, football pitches, playgrounds etc etc- let alone growing plants at Norton nurseries and doing up empty buildings. And if some money isn't found from somewhere things will get a whole lot worse, not just in parks but throughout all services; and that is before the next 3 years of cuts which will be coming, another 15%, then another 10% and another 10% and that's on top of three years already. Very soon the council will be operating on 50% of the budget it had 5-6 years ago.

 

When JG Graves gifted this park I am sure the council, or he, never conceived they'd be in this sort of financial position.

 

That said - yes - if this is a part of the charitable donation bequeathed to the city council it should not be sold off - but what would you rather happened - parks do this building up or make 2 more staff redundant? The result is that for years keeping the staff has been more important - that is why the building is run-down I'd guess not because of some plot. It's a matter of priorities and to an extent doing up that building, although it shouldn't be, is now a luxury when children's services are being cut etc etc

 

If everyone here is so worried why don't you all meet up and raise the funds to do up and maintain the building - become an active part of the charitable trust - organise a sponsored event and magic up a few hundred grand to keep the building going for a few years...

[megalithic]

Thing is, which you may be missing, IT DOESN'T BELONG TO THEM.

 

Can i sell your house, or car ?

[Tallgrass]

Thing is, which you may be missing, IT DOESN'T BELONG TO THEM.

 

Can i sell your house, or car ?

 

Ok well fair enough - but why are they being blamed for letting it get into a state of disrepair then? They simply administer the funds for the Graves Park charitable trust then do they? So the question is - has the trust got the money to do it up? Agreed it shouldn't be sold off but it will just sit there getting worse and worse then until it is no use to anyone then?

Edited August 1, 2013 by Tallgrass

[megalithic]

Ok well fair enough - but why are they being blamed for letting it get into a state of disrepair then? They simply administer the funds for the JG Graves charitable trust then do they? So the question is - has the trust got the money to do it up? Agreed it shouldn't be sold off but it will just sit there getting worse and worse then until it is no use to anyone then?

 

I'm not going to pretend to have all the answers, i don't. Maybe they could let it long term for a nominal ?

[Tallgrass]

http://meetings.sheffield.gov.uk/council-meetings/cabinet/agendas-2013/agenda-17th-july-2013

 

Read item 16 on this page for full detail. They openly state they would need the permission of the Charities Commission to sell this building.

 

Seems there is a Graves Park Charitable Trust (of which 'the council' are the trustees- and so cabinet can make the decision?); and the JG Graves Charitable Trust - one for the park and one for grant-making to voluntary groups etc.

 

Also states the Friends of GP group have been advised.

 

Lets hope the CC says no?

[Mecky]

Maybe, if SCC didn't have its throat cut by central government it wouldn't have to sell part of Graves Park, maybe it wouldn't have to increase the revenue it makes from parking charges/fines to offset the shortfall in funding.

[Hillpig]

Surely we should be grateful for the council seeking to maintain what services it can in a time of financial austerity?

 

Managing a great city such as ours must be incredibly difficult with finite resources. If it is necessary to dispose of assets to maintain other expenditure then regretfully it has to happen.

 

Had the Labour government not ruined the country with its profligate spending throughout its time in power Sheffield council would not be in this position.

[barpen]

http://meetings.sheffield.gov.uk/council-meetings/cabinet/agendas-2013/agenda-17th-july-2013

 

Read item 16 on this page for full detail. They openly state they would need the permission of the Charities Commission to sell this building.

 

Seems there is a Graves Park Charitable Trust (of which 'the council' are the trustees- and so cabinet can make the decision?); and the JG Graves Charitable Trust - one for the park and one for grant-making to voluntary groups etc.

 

Also states the Friends of GP group have been advised.

 

Lets hope the CC says no?

 

 

There is no such thing as the Graves Park Charitable Trust. There is however a Graves Park Charity of which the councillors are trustees.

 

But here's the rub. The trustees of any charity must always act in the best interests of the charity. So whilst considering any aspect of the park they need to put asside the interests of the council. So whilst the council might like to sell the whole of the park as a housing estate and pocket a few million quid, their duty is to the park so they can't.

 

There is also a clause written into the charitable deeds of the park that requires the following.

If any building is surplus to requirements it must be demolished.

If it is necessary to dispose of any land the proceeds must be used to buy land of equal value and amenity value to the park.

 

Regarding who owns the actual park. It belongs to the Graves Park Charity, who hold the land on behalf of the people of Sheffield (not the council). The council agreed to fund maintenance of the park in exchange for the land being given as a park from the recreational use of the people of Sheffield.

 

So imagine the council are tennants and the cottage is a rented property. The council as tennants are responsible for the neglect and damage they have inflicted on the property in their desire for it to become derelict as an excuse for its disposal.

 

I think done up like a kipper springs to mind.

Edited August 1, 2013 by barpen

[caparo]

I've just heard that the council is discussing declaring Cobnar Cottage surplus to requirements with a view to selling it off on the private housing market.

 

Cobnar Cottage is part of Graves Park and was a gift to the people of Sheffield and no provision in the charity documents exists for its sale.

 

It is pretty disgusting that the property is currently run down as it is the duty of the city council as trustees of the Graves Park Charity to maintain it.

 

There's not much they wouldn't stoop too to act against the interest of a charity for which they are trustees.