Alfer Posted August 18, 2013 Share Posted August 18, 2013 Has anyone successfully got their parents carehome fees paid for by the NHS. Wondering wwhether my Dads needs would technically speaking warrant a trained nurse which is how its decided. He does need picking up off the floor 5-6times a day, having cuts and bruises dressed, and medication monitored... but I understand that may well be deemed social needs rather than nursing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cressida Posted August 18, 2013 Share Posted August 18, 2013 I would think he needed 24hour care if he was in danger of causing mental or physical damage to himself, he would need to be assessed wouldn't he? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alfer Posted August 18, 2013 Author Share Posted August 18, 2013 Thnx Cressida.. He has been assessed... but not deemed bad enough to be entitled to NHS funding. i know its not just me this is affecting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cressida Posted August 18, 2013 Share Posted August 18, 2013 :)ok thought I'd bump the thread hoping someone could be of more help Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alfer Posted August 18, 2013 Author Share Posted August 18, 2013 Great.. and it helped me to write about it . I started on the appeal letter . :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinfoilhat Posted August 18, 2013 Share Posted August 18, 2013 Sadly, I don't think (and by "I" I mean the Nhs) will see it is a nursing issue. Without sounding callous (I'm in the same boat with my dad) he won't need a nurse to pick him up off the floor, a care worker will do, hence the Nhs won't fork out for continuing care. As he may well end up in a care home, the social may well pick up some/all of the tab depending on the overall cost and his (yours?) circumstances. The bar for continuing care is very very high. Sorry I haven't got better news. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cressida Posted August 18, 2013 Share Posted August 18, 2013 Medusa and MsMacbeth may be able to help Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ccit Posted August 18, 2013 Share Posted August 18, 2013 From what you describe as being his problems it is unlikely that he will be assessed as needing nursing care. Hopefully he will fall less frequently now that he is under supervision. Cuts and bruises can be treated by the visiting district nurse - they shouldn't need 24 hour nursing care. For people to be assessed as needing nursing care there should be treatment that has to be undertaken by a qualified nurse. An example of this is airway support e.g. tracheostomy, oxygen, etc. Are you wanting to appeal because your father is self funding? If he had been assessed as needing nursing care the fees would be met. I do think that you will have a battle on your hands. The criteria is specific and, as mentioned above, the bar is set high. You might find more information on the Age concern website. You will need to do a lot of study, particularly into what counts as nursing care. It would be prudent not to get you hopes up but of course it is always worth a try. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alfer Posted August 19, 2013 Author Share Posted August 19, 2013 Thanks for replies. I really appreciate it. What do you think MsMacbeth & Medusa would have to add? Yes, for the record I am primarily wanting to appeal as Dad self funded and house will have to go at some point etc... which seems unfair. I have already been advised he would be very unlikely to qualify and as I dip in and out of feeling compelled to try to save it / him and being grateful he can afford one of the nicer carehomes and that I therefore dont have to look after him myself . But I'm interested enough to want to know the whys and wherefores and yes, I agree that the crux of the matter is what constitutes nursing and social care. I suspect it would be easier to prove his needs are not social than that they are nursing but I might contact the Parkinsons Disease Society to see if they can help. And I might see if I can get legal aid for a solicitor.. Might being the operative word here as its really a case of picking your battles.... Without wanting to patronise anyone surely much of what nurses and carers do overlaps. But I know I would have a battle on my hands. Wonder how they deal with the issue of mental illness here ... seeing as Dad has high levels of paranoia and anxiety that he should in an ideal world be getting help with, but given his age and perceived usefulness to society isn't. ---------- Post added 19-08-2013 at 09:39 ---------- Thanks for replies. I really appreciate it. What do you think MsMacbeth & Medusa would have to add? Yes, for the record I am primarily wanting to appeal as Dad self funded and house will have to go at some point etc... which seems unfair. I have already been advised he would be very unlikely to qualify and as I dip in and out of feeling compelled to try to save it / him and being grateful he can afford one of the nicer carehomes and that I therefore dont have to look after him myself . But I'm interested enough to want to know the whys and wherefores and yes, I agree that the crux of the matter is what constitutes nursing and social care. I suspect it would be easier to prove his needs are not social than that they are nursing but I might contact the Parkinsons Disease Society to see if they can help. And I might see if I can get legal aid for a solicitor.. Might being the operative word here as its really a case of picking your battles.... Without wanting to patronise anyone surely much of what nurses and carers do overlaps. But I know I would have a battle on my hands. Wonder how they deal with the issue of mental illness here ... seeing as Dad has high levels of paranoia and anxiety that he should in an ideal world be getting help with, but given his age and perceived usefulness to society isn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ccit Posted August 19, 2013 Share Posted August 19, 2013 Your dilemma is understandable because if he was self-funded he might get a better care home place. However, I do think that you should contact a few establishments to check this because it may be that the difference in funded/self funded places is minimal. The fact that he has Parkinsons Disease might help in your appeal as it is an ongoing condition with no expectation of recovery. I have just been checking the Age UK website and found this document which might help, particularly section 5.3 which explains the Decision Support Tool, used in helping the services to come to decision about what kind of care is required. I think you need to sit down with that in front of you and make a detailed list of all your father's care needs. This may help you to formulate your appeal. Do this before you see a solicitor. BTW - might be worth telephoning AgeUK as well as the Parkinsons Society to see if they can recommend anyone. I think you are right in contacting the Parkinsons Society because they have more knowledge of the illness itself and the effect of it on the individual plus prognosis. Building your case around that might be expedient. These days nursing care is expensive and qualified nurses not easy to come by so there is a lot of work undertaken by the care assistant that might have been done by a nurse a few years ago. Medication is one of them, as is pressure area care, including incontinence. Even people who are totally immobile and require hoists might not qualify. Some residents have their nursing needs met by the visiting district nurse. An example would be dressings, administration of insulin/monitoring of diabetes, catheter care. As you say, you will have a battle on your hands, particularly because like most people, you are not in a position to know what constitutes nursing care. Regardless of funding, most people want their relatives cared for by the most appropriate grade of staff - that is the important issue. I wish you luck with the appeal and hope that you will return to the thread at some point in the future to update it as this is such a common problem and it would be very helpful for others who are going through this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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