Syria megathread- is British government desperate for another war?

[Harleyman]

I'm quite sure if this kicked off in the thirties it wouldn't have been news. There wasn't really an international community as such - just an assorted bunch of colonial and former colonial powers.

 

Did America do anything as a result of say, the nanking massacre? No they didn't. Nobody did. There have massacres, civil wars and all manner of nastiness through the ages where the world did nowt.

 

What lead to the biggest war were a progression of events that in some cases were disconnected with the reasons for starting the big one later on.

 

The Japanese invaded Manchuria in the 1930s and carried out massacres and nothing was done by the big powers to stop it. There were some restrictions put on exports to Japan by the US but it wasnt enough to make the Japanese leave China. Later in search of more raw materials they started to construct a navy and air force to invade and seize by force Malaya, Indo- China and a sizeable chunk of the rest of south-east Asia

 

Hitler came to power in the 1920s and in violation of restrictions placed against Germany after WW One started to rebuild his army, navy and air force.

There may have been some voices raised in the League of Nations but nevertheless nothing was done to stop it.

 

Later he sided with Franco in the Spanish civil war and his new air force was used in that war to bomb and kill hundreds of people in the large cities.

The only help the Spanish got was from outside in the form of volunteers most of them signing on to fight Franco.

 

Hitler must have begun to get the idea that Britain and France had no stomach to get involved and the USA was distant and only interested in it's own problems

 

 

 

After that he annexed Austria and carved up Czechoslovakia and again nothing was done uintil it reached a point where something had to be done to defend Poland but by then it was a bit too late to realistically stop him from attacking that country

 

This current war in Syria could follow the history of what happened above and spread to a much bigger war throughout the middle east. The agreement by Syria to hand over it's WMDs doesn't include any agreement to end the civil war and if Obama and Putin think it did in any way then they're only fooling themselves

 

---------- Post added 14-09-2013 at 21:23 ----------

 

Putin has demonstrated from the onset of the Syrian crisis that he is the one in control, with warnings, to some extent.

Now he has been successful in manipulating influence with these fresh plans, and the deal about the weapons.

Putin the hero? who would ever have thought it!

 

Call him a hero if and when these WMDs are actually all handed over and in safe hands. Until then he's only a politician who managed to come up with a good idea while everyone else was ditherng around

Edited September 14, 2013 by Harleyman

[I1L2T3]

Putin has demonstrated from the onset of the Syrian crisis that he is the one in control, with warnings, to some extent.

Now he has been successful in manipulating influence with these fresh plans, and the deal about the weapons.

Putin the hero? who would ever have thought it!

 

He's eaten Obama for breakfast.

 

Now we find out just how dangerous, crazy and desperate Obama is.

[Chris_Sleeps]

Putin was stung by what happened in Libya. He backed western support of the rebels and then watched as America (and allies) meddled in the outcome. Syria is also a neighbour of Russia, and better-the-devil-you-know is a factor.

 

There are some good examples of western intervention (Yugoslavia), bad examples (Iraq) - and equally good and bad examples of the west staying out of internal conflict (Rwanda). Politics can be messy, and war isn't something to celebrate.

 

Messy. My only thought. Messy.

[Harleyman]

Poll shows 75% of US military personnel oppose strikes against Syria:

 

http://www.militarytimes.com/interactive/article/20130911/NEWS/309110009/Troops-oppose-strikes-Syria-by-3-1-margin

 

Support for Obama's war is limited. Will he lose the trust of the military?

 

750 military personnel polled hardly an army make Obama is Commander in Chief and if he decides on strikes the military will carry out his orders to a man no matter what their private opinions might be.

 

Soldiers who serve a democracy are and never were mindless robots without opinions of their own but they do what has to be done

 

---------- Post added 14-09-2013 at 21:36 ----------

 

He's eaten Obama for breakfast.

 

Now we find out just how dangerous, crazy and desperate Obama is.

 

What kind of crap does SKY News tell you folks? Or have you come to your conclusion about Obama from some Pixie's post on Bootoob?

[I1L2T3]

750 military personnel polled hardly an army make Obama is Commander in Chief and if he decides on strikes the military will carry out his orders to a man no matter what their private opinions might be.

 

Soldiers who serve a democracy are and never were mindless robots without opinions of their own but they do what has to be done

 

I didn't say they wouldn't carry out orders

 

I asked whether they will continue to trust Obama!

 

---------- Post added 14-09-2013 at 22:41 ----------

 

750 military personnel polled hardly an army make Obama is Commander in Chief and if he decides on strikes the military will carry out his orders to a man no matter what their private opinions might be.

 

Soldiers who serve a democracy are and never were mindless robots without opinions of their own but they do what has to be done

 

---------- Post added 14-09-2013 at 21:36 ----------

 

 

What kind of crap does SKY News tell you folks? Or have you come to your conclusion about Obama from some Pixie's post on Bootoob?

 

I don't watch Sky news.

[Harleyman]

I didn't say they wouldn't carry out orders

 

I asked whether they will continue to trust Obama!

 

---------- Post added 14-09-2013 at 22:41 ----------

 

 

I don't watch Sky news.

 

Why shouldn't they? Do you think the high rollers in the Pentagon dont know that any scenario can change when diplomatic manouvering gets into play. That's what politicians do

 

So if not Sky News whose telling you that Obama is some crazy foaming at the mouth desperate for war demagogue?

 

Could it be Network Erebus ?

[janie48]

 

Call him a hero if and when these WMDs are actually all handed over and in safe hands. Until then he's only a politician who managed to come up with a good idea while everyone else was ditherng around

 

The hero comment was just a figure of speech, his idea is certainly a better alternative to air strikes, but he was the reason the peace talks didn't materialise earlier in the year.

Edited September 14, 2013 by janie48

[I1L2T3]

Why shouldn't they? Do you think the high rollers in the Pentagon dont know that any scenario can change when diplomatic manouvering gets into play. That's what politicians do

 

So if not Sky News whose telling you that Obama is some crazy foaming at the mouth desperate for war demagogue?

 

Could it be Network Erebus ?

 

He's desperate for war IMO

 

---------- Post added 14-09-2013 at 23:11 ----------

 

The hero comment was just a figure of speech, his idea is certainly a better alternative to air strikes, but he was the reason the peace talks didn't materialise earlier in the year.

 

He's eaten Obama for breakfast.

 

Now we find out just how dangerous,

crazy and desperate Obama is.[/quote.

 

He doesn't warrant those accusations.

 

Why not? He was on the brink of unleashing a dangerous scenario only a madman would want.

[Harleyman]

The hero comment was just a figure of speech, his idea is certainly a better alternative to air strikes, but he was the reason the peace talks didn't materialise earlier in the year.

 

He's eaten Obama for breakfast.

 

Now we find out just how dangerous,

crazy and desperate Obama is.[/quote.

 

He doesn't warrant those accusations.

 

He has no reason to want peace talks. Assad is an ally and if he were to go then there's always the chance that his other ally Iran's Ayatollahs might be next.

Uprisings against dictators seem to be the in thing in that part of the world of late

 

---------- Post added 14-09-2013 at 22:20 ----------

 

He's desperate for war IMO

 

---------- Post added 14-09-2013 at 23:11 ----------

 

The hero comment was just a figure of speech, his idea is certainly a better alternative to air strikes, but he was the reason the peace talks didn't materialise earlier in the year.

 

 

 

Why not? He was on the brink of unleashing a dangerous scenario only a madman would want.

 

He wasnt on the brink at all. In fact he decided to go against practices by past presidents and go to Congress instead and it seems likely that Congress would not have approved it anyway.

 

The only mad man here is Assad. It seems almost biblical that hundreds of thousands could die and 2-1/2 million Syrians have now left the country because basically it started as a member of a tribe who wasn't much liked as a leader by other tribes and is nevertheless determined to stay in power whatever the cost

[mafya]

The hero comment was just a figure of speech, his idea is certainly a better alternative to air strikes, but he was the reason the peace talks didn't materialise earlier in the year.

 

 

 

He has no reason to want peace talks. Assad is an ally and if he were to go then there's always the chance that his other ally Iran's Ayatollahs might be next.

Uprisings against dictators seem to be the in thing in that part of the world of late

 

---------- Post added 14-09-2013 at 22:20 ----------

 

He's desperate for war IMO

 

---------- Post added 14-09-2013 at 23:11 ----------

 

 

He wasnt on the brink at all. In fact he decided to go against practices by past presidents and go to Congress instead and it seems likely that Congress would not have approved it anyway.

 

The only mad man here is Assad. It seems almost biblical that hundreds of thousands could die and 2-1/2 million Syrians have now left the country because basically it started as a member of a tribe who wasn't much liked as a leader by other tribes and is nevertheless determined to stay in power whatever the cost

 

In reply to Harleymans post=

You haven't read the links in post 326 than about the rebels beheading children yet are quick to call Assad a madman!

The US and Britain support the rebels who are doing the beheading and burning Christian churches and you say Assad is a mad man when in fact his back is against the wall and he is fighting for his life.

Edited September 14, 2013 by mafya