Hillpig Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 Do not despair, Milliband and Balls have won this for Cameron already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vague_Boy Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 wherein the country is simply being bled dry of its wealth. You speak as if the nation has an automatic right to be successful, just by existing. The "wealth" of a country has to be earned. Delusional economics based on cheap credit, money printing and selling each other the same pile of bricks at ever increasing prices cuts no ice with the productive economies of the world. They have paid the price, for going into government with a bunch of cretins. Certainly Labour never entertained the idea of a coalition with the LibDems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonkatoy Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 Absolutely. And Milliband will join them, along with Menzies Campbell. I don't understand how Ed thinks he can dictate prices and impose regulations on the industry, conveniently ignoring petrol prices. After all, Labour haven't had much luck in the past at trying this. Who will benefit most from a pegged energy price? Would it be a pensioner with a one bar electric fire or a billionaire with a 90 room mansion and a heated swimming pool? Ed's looking after his rich chums like Tony Blair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blake Posted September 27, 2013 Share Posted September 27, 2013 What alternative did they have? They didn't have a majority. they could have gone for a minority government. After 7 months governing as a minority government between March and October 1974 Harold Wilson went to the country and was returned with an overall majority. I'm not sure if that would necessarily have been a good idea, but at least the Tories would have avoided going into government with what has basically been the fourth form of a bog standard comprehensive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L00b Posted September 27, 2013 Share Posted September 27, 2013 You speak as if the nation has an automatic right to be successful, just by existing.That was certainly not the intended meaning: it was simply stating the logical conclusion of stripping the country of most if not all of the wealth-producing element of its national economy (which was the main point). Selling at a point-of-sale does not create wealth: it simply crystallises it into profit. Until that point, wealth has been embedded into the product/offerring, but is immaterial: it can only be secured (and the profit effectively earned, then taxed) if people buy the product/offerring. A nation is entirely like a business, it has to adapt to survive and (preferably-) strive. By definition, it's up to the (successive-) governments to ensure it does, through relevant policies favouring the national economy sufficiently to retain the wealth-producing bits of it. But enough truisms... The "wealth" of a country has to be earned. Delusional economics based on cheap credit, money printing and selling each other the same pile of bricks at ever increasing prices cuts no ice with the productive economies of the world.Indeed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hillpig Posted September 27, 2013 Share Posted September 27, 2013 Oh well,I guess I will still vote Labour regardless. By doing so you follow the herd, fall into the trap that holds Sheffield and South Yorkshire back, by following the dictum "if they were good enough for my father they are good enough for me". You condemn yourself, your family and your community to stasis, to mediocrity, to bringing everyone down to a level at which the herd mentality can deal with them. Dare to think, to let your mind expand and take in the possibilities of self employment, enrichment and progress. You will only do this in a socially responsible, progressive and capitalist system. In this country that is encapsulated by the Conservative party. ---------- Post added 27-09-2013 at 09:57 ---------- 18 months before the poll, Labour are on course to just cruise it by a narrow margin if they don't do anything stupid. Even the Tories know this and a lot of them fear that the coalition may have diluted the Tory brand. nobody knows just what exactly the Tories are supposed to be for any more. They have paid the price, for going into government with a bunch of cretins. The Lib Dems are not cretins, as a third party they never thought they would be in power, certainly not with a Conservative partner. They are, in the main, thoroughly decent people, they have their share of weirdoes but so do the other party. I believe they did what they thought was the right thing, after Labour ruined the country with their profligacy and corruption, lies and deceit, the Lib Dems could have stood back and watched the Tories try to run a minority government. This would have led to chaos. The 2010 election was never going to be a good one to win. In order to get the country back to solvency difficult decisions have had to be made. No government was going to remain popular in these circumstances. The Lib Dems have been honorable and true to their word. They should be respected. I am a member of the Conservative party. ---------- Post added 27-09-2013 at 09:58 ---------- 18 months before the poll, Labour are on course to just cruise it by a narrow margin if they don't do anything stupid. Even the Tories know this and a lot of them fear that the coalition may have diluted the Tory brand. nobody knows just what exactly the Tories are supposed to be for any more. They have paid the price, for going into government with a bunch of cretins. The Lib Dems are not cretins, as a third party they never thought they would be in power, certainly not with a Conservative partner. They are, in the main, thoroughly decent people, they have their share of weirdoes but so do the other parties. I believe they did what they thought was the right thing, after Labour ruined the country with their profligacy and corruption, lies and deceit, the Lib Dems could have stood back and watched the Tories try to run a minority government. This would have led to chaos. The 2010 election was never going to be a good one to win. In order to get the country back to solvency difficult decisions have had to be made. No government was going to remain popular in these circumstances. The Lib Dems have been honorable and true to their word. They should be respected. I am a member of the Conservative party. ---------- Post added 27-09-2013 at 11:21 ---------- I apologize for the double posting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manlinose Posted September 27, 2013 Share Posted September 27, 2013 i almost stood up and applauded that post - although I'm not sure the second comment was so good it merited an encore although the first and third paragraphs are not strictly true, I like the sentiment in the middle many people have many and varied reasons for voting for the labour party and/or not voting for the nasty, i'm sorry, the conservative party - and slavish adherence to the past is not the only one - many self employed people vote labour - i've even done it myself in the past i also agree (god help me) with some of the comments in your second post - some of my best friends know people who have been members of the lib dems and they assure me they are not as cretinous as they at first appear however, i do take issue (so my peace of mind is restored) with a couple of things the lib dems did think they would be involved in Government after the last election (or at least they hoped they would be) and i'm sure it crossed their mind that it was as likely to be with the conservatives as with labour a minority government would not automatically have led to chaos - the conservatives and lib dems could have agreed a budget and then left other policies to be voted on a case by case basis - it would almost certainly have resulted in an election sooner rather than later but that may well have been to the conservative party's advantage the lib dems have not been true to their word on many things (which is the way of most political lives), but i believe they have acted, in most part, in what they considered at the time to be the best interests of the Country and at great cost to the standing of the party in a lot of constituencies - and for that they should be, as you say, respected i am not, and never have been, a member of the conservative party Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uptowngirl Posted September 27, 2013 Share Posted September 27, 2013 18 months before the poll, Labour are on course to just cruise it by a narrow margin if they don't do anything stupid. Even the Tories know this and a lot of them fear that the coalition may have diluted the Tory brand. nobody knows just what exactly the Tories are supposed to be for any more. They have paid the price, for going into government with a bunch of cretins. Oddly enough I would say exactly the opposite. It is a surprise that Labour isn't far ahead in the polls after 3 years of austerity. But now the economy is on the mend and the deficit falling I think there is time for a bit of feel good before May 2015. Then there's the Tories trump card........... Ed Miliband. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manlinose Posted September 27, 2013 Share Posted September 27, 2013 Oddly enough I would say exactly the opposite. It is a surprise that Labour isn't far ahead in the polls after 3 years of austerity. But now the economy is on the mend and the deficit falling I think there is time for a bit of feel good before May 2015. Then there's the Tories trump card........... Ed Miliband. it's not that much of a surprise that labour aren't further ahead in the opinion polls considering the legacy left by the last government other than that i think you may be right - i'm just not convinced that their trump card will be enough to outweigh the jokers being played by UKIP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uptowngirl Posted September 27, 2013 Share Posted September 27, 2013 it's not that much of a surprise that labour aren't further ahead in the opinion polls considering the legacy left by the last government other than that i think you may be right - i'm just not convinced that their trump card will be enough to outweigh the jokers being played by UKIP You might be right, but I'm not sure that in the cold light of day folks will actually turn up and vote UKIP at a General Election. They've don'e well in the past at European elections etc, but a general election is another matter. Then again the Tories are the one promising the referendum on EU membership and I'm not convinced UKIP only takes votes from the Tories. These fringe parties usually seem to do well in places like Rotherham & Barnsley. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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