Ed Miliband Has Wrecked The Labour Party.

[Hillpig]

Socialism is finished. It is dead in this country and all over the world. Cameron will romp into power in 2015. He has played the Liberals brilliantly.

 

The British public have been lied to by the Labour party and the unions by trying to keep the class war bubbling, the public have seen through this façade and see with their own eyes that they can be successful in business and through employment no matter what their background.

 

The future is rosy and its blue, a blue rose in fact.

 

Vote Tory, you know it makes sense.

[Manlinose]

Labour election chances diminish with every bit of good news on the economy. They pedalled a line to gain popularity by pretending we didn't need to pay our debts, and that has unravelled.

 

That's why the good news on the economy is greeted with such distain by the left wing. They want us deep in the mire when the election comes around, and that doesn't look like happening.

 

it isn't true to say they "pedalled a line to gain popularity by pretending we didn't need to pay our debts"

 

they argued that the deficit reduction should be slower and over a longer period of time than that proposed by the conservatives

 

as it happens, the coalition policies have had the same effect - the deficit is being reduced more slowly and over a longer period than originally planned - but that is by accident rather than by design

 

you are right, though, that, the worse the economic indicators are, the happier labour will be - i suppose the best they can argue at the moment is that the economy hasn't improved as much as it should have done or would have done if they had been in charge and/or that the economic pain and suffering of the last few years have not been worth the small gains made - i'm not convinced either are plausible arguments, but then i haven't suffered

[Emily Moore]

it isn't true to say they "pedalled a line to gain popularity by pretending we didn't need to pay our debts"

 

they argued that the deficit reduction should be slower and over a longer period of time than that proposed by the conservatives

 

as it happens, the coalition policies have had the same effect - the deficit is being reduced more slowly and over a longer period than originally planned - but that is by accident rather than by design

 

you are right, though, that, the worse the economic indicators are, the happier labour will be - i suppose the best they can argue at the moment is that the economy hasn't improved as much as it should have done or would have done if they had been in charge and/or that the economic pain and suffering of the last few years have not been worth the small gains made - i'm not convinced either are plausible arguments, but then i haven't suffered

 

We will differ re the debts but I'd agree on most of the rest.

 

The big problem for Labour and the current line is that they would say that wouldn't they. There is no evidence to suggest that their policies would have got us out of the shyt and may well have dumped us deeper into it.

 

That's the dilema for the electorate come 2015 when I assume the economy will be doing pretty nicely. Do you say to Cameron, "Carry on. The medicine wasn't nice, but at least we are cured".. or do you take a leap of faith and trust those who got us into the shyt not to drop us straight back into it? Then of course there's Miliband. In the cold light of day I think that he may well be a leap of faith too far.

[Mecky]

We will differ re the debts but I'd agree on most of the rest.

 

The big problem for Labour and the current line is that they would say that wouldn't they. There is no evidence to suggest that their policies would have got us out of the shyt and may well have dumped us deeper into it.

 

That's the dilema for the electorate come 2015 when I assume the economy will be doing pretty nicely. Do you say to Cameron, "Carry on. The medicine wasn't nice, but at least we are cured".. or do you take a leap of faith and trust those who got us into the shyt not to drop us straight back into it? Then of course there's Miliband. In the cold light of day I think that he may well be a leap of faith too far.

 

How do you account for the fact that we were able to cope better than most european countries from 2008 to 2010 but now things have got worse under this government?

[Hillpig]

I bet you won't come the 2015 election though

 

He will vote Conservative. As will anyone with any common sense.

[Vague_Boy]

How do you account for the fact that we were able to cope better than most european countries from 2008 to 2010

 

That's what Gordon Brown claimed:

 

Britain well-placed to withstand uncertainty, says Prime Minister

 

PRIME MINISTER Gordon Brown believes Britain is "well-placed" to withstand the global financial turbulence which has seen stock markets tumble around the world, his spokesman said yesterday.

 

LINK [23 January 2008]

 

 

But as for what actually happened....

 

Why is Recession Hitting UK hardest? [February 2, 2009]

 

Britain to suffer worst recession of any advanced nation, says IMF [2009]

 

UK finance sector hit harder by downturn than competing financial hubs, survey shows [5th May 2009]

 

Europe's recession officially ends as Britain lags behind [13 November 2009]

 

Shock Figures Show UK In Worst Ever Recession [October 23rd, 2009]

 

 

Note the dates on all those stories. All during your mythical period before things turned to sh*t with the Coalition (well, according to you).

 

and also....

 

Darling 'was wrong' on recession

 

Chancellor Alistair Darling has admitted the Treasury got it wrong over the length and depth of the recession.

 

"The downturn since last autumn has been far deeper than people expected in any part of the world," he told the BBC's Andrew Marr Show.

 

He declined to forecast ahead of his Budget how much the UK economy would shrink during the current year.

 

The Tories asked why anyone would "believe Gordon Brown's claims about his economic policies ever again".

 

LINK [bBC News, Sunday, 5 April 2009]

 

So I quote you again

 

How do you account for the fact that we were able to cope better than most european countries from 2008 to 2010

 

Links? Evidence? Anything?

 

Unless by "most European countries" you mean Greece?

[Emily Moore]

How do you account for the fact that we were able to cope better than most european countries from 2008 to 2010 but now things have got worse under this government?

 

Simple. We weren't better off than most European countries other than the PIGs. You just made the rest up. But we've come to expect that of your posts which is why everyone takes them with a very big pinch of salt. Mecky cies wolf far too many times.

[Mecky]

Simple. We weren't better off than most European countries other than the PIGs. You just made the rest up. But we've come to expect that of your posts which is why everyone takes them with a very big pinch of salt. Mecky cies wolf far too many times.

 

No, I haven't

[Manlinose]

That's the dilema for the electorate come 2015 when I assume the economy will be doing pretty nicely. Do you say to Cameron, "Carry on. The medicine wasn't nice, but at least we are cured".. or do you take a leap of faith and trust those who got us into the shyt not to drop us straight back into it? Then of course there's Miliband. In the cold light of day I think that he may well be a leap of faith too far.

 

it is indeed the dilemma - we won't be cured, but we should be on an upward curve - there is a debate to be had about how much of that is down to government policy, but no doubt the coalition will be claiming the credit and no doubt labour will be trying to argue that the natural evolution of a recession is a period of growth and the economy would be "doing pretty nicely" anyway.

 

the winner (if there is one) will be the party which is given more of the benefit of the doubt

 

for what it is worth, my own opinion is that it is irrelevant who the leader of the labour party is - the government has not done badly enough for the electorate to want to kick them out and it is too early for the electorate to just want a change - the two great unknowns are, how will ukip affect the conservative vote in the key marginal seats and, if those who voted libdem last time don't do so this time, who will they support?

 

the best time to be labour leader may well be towards the end of the next election (or maybe the one after that) when Cameron will have called it a day and George Osborne has taken over after overseeing the miraculous economic recovery (assuming the conservatives don't have the imagination to go for Boris Johnson)

[Mecky]

it is indeed the dilemma - we won't be cured, but we should be on an upward curve - there is a debate to be had about how much of that is down to government policy, but no doubt the coalition will be claiming the credit and no doubt labour will be trying to argue that the natural evolution of a recession is a period of growth and the economy would be "doing pretty nicely" anyway.

 

the winner (if there is one) will be the party which is given more of the benefit of the doubt

for what it is worth, my own opinion is that it is irrelevant who the leader of the labour party is - the government has not done badly enough for the electorate to want to kick them out and it is too early for the electorate to just want a change - the two great unknowns are, how will ukip affect the conservative vote in the key marginal seats and, if those who voted libdem last time don't do so this time, who will they support?

 

the best time to be labour leader may well be towards the end of the next election (or maybe the one after that) when Cameron will have called it a day and George Osborne has taken over after overseeing the miraculous economic recovery (assuming the conservatives don't have the imagination to go for Boris Johnson)

 

Which is the reason for this thread in the first place - To try and influence public opinion