avidcameron Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 Both those things could be said about Americans. They aren't culturally European. And neither are we. We are a country of our own, not merely part of a group of countries. I think you are describing your own disposition and I resent you answering on my behalf and many associates who are pro-,even pan-European.If you do express an opinion ayt least use English with a little more style-I have outlined the offending sentence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I1L2T3 Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 Not as much as we could; being in the EU restricts our trade with the rest of the world. ---------- Post added 09-10-2013 at 21:16 ---------- Are you too in denial about what the end game of the EU project actually is, and have you thought what that would mean for Britain and the overseas territories, the commonwealth and the uniquely British NHS? I just don't see how a mere single constituent part of a state can have overseas territories, be the head of a commonwealth of 53 other countries, and have its own unique self contained health service. How will that work?? More food for thought, surely a single state needs a common media space, so what will that mean for the BBC? I agree the EU is a limiting factor but it doesn't mean we shouldn't stay in and reshape it. There aren't many things I agree with David Cameron on but I support his view that we need to stay in the EU but on renegotiated terms. The ability to rekindle ties with our historical trading partners is a must. It's something Spain could benefit from with the Latin American world and France to an extent with the Francophone world. It's not just for us - more flexibility in trading agreements could be positive for some countries. Not sure Germany would like it much though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sick again Posted October 9, 2013 Author Share Posted October 9, 2013 I agree the EU is a limiting factor but it doesn't mean we shouldn't stay in and reshape it. There aren't many things I agree with David Cameron on but I support his view that we need to stay in the EU but on renegotiated terms. The ability to rekindle ties with our historical trading partners is a must. It's something Spain could benefit from with the Latin American world and France to an extent with the Francophone world. It's not just for us - more flexibility in trading agreements could be positive for some countries. Not sure Germany would like it much though. I agree with you here, I've not advocated shunning Europe, its just that apart from Germany, a federal Europe is bad news for western European countries as we have historical ties and interests in other parts of the world that we could be exploiting more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vague_Boy Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 how could one constituant part of a state have so much responsibility and importance to itself separate from the rest of the state it is a constituent part of The Commonwealth isn't a state. state Pronunciation: /steɪt/ 2a nation or territory considered as an organized political community under one government LINK The UK government doesn't run Australia for example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I1L2T3 Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 I agree with you here, I've not advocated shunning Europe, its just that apart from Germany, a federal Europe is bad news for western European countries as we have historical ties and interests in other parts of the world that we could be exploiting more. That's why we need to renegotiate. We need to be better able to access growing markets in India. Portugal has its arms tied behind its back as Brazil's economy rapidly expands. Spain the same with the rest of Latin America. It isn't just us that are held back. The EU shouldn't be inward looking relying on Germany as the only strong core state to prop the whole thing up. It's not the 70s any more. IMO the EU should revert to being primarily a trading bloc and on those terms we should stay in. If the political and financial union goes much further like you I'd be very disturbed but the commonwealth as a key reason for leaving is not a solid enough reason for getting out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sick again Posted October 9, 2013 Author Share Posted October 9, 2013 The Commonwealth isn't a state. LINK The UK government doesn't run Australia for example. I don't think you've understood me, I'm asking how could a mere constituent part(Britain) of a state(a federal Europe) be the head of a commonwealth of other countries. ---------- Post added 09-10-2013 at 22:21 ---------- That's why we need to renegotiate. We need to be better able to access growing markets in India. Portugal has its arms tied behind its back as Brazil's economy rapidly expands. Spain the same with the rest of Latin America. It isn't just us that are held back. The EU shouldn't be inward looking relying on Germany as the only strong core state to prop the whole thing up. It's not the 70s any more. IMO the EU should revert to being primarily a trading bloc and on those terms we should stay in. If the political and financial union goes much further like you I'd be very disturbed but the commonwealth as a key reason for leaving is not a solid enough reason for getting out. I agree with you, and I'm not saying the commonwealth is a reason for getting out, I'm saying its a big reason why we can't go whole hog into the EU, ie, join the Euro and poitically and fiscally merge with the rest of Europe, in effect getting enveloped by it and becoming a mere constituent part of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I1L2T3 Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 I don't think you've understood me, I'm asking how could a mere constituent part(Britain) of a state(a federal Europe) be the head of a commonwealth of other countries. Because the commonwealth is not an economic union, not a political union. It is a cultural and social body promoting intergovernmental cooperation in a number of arenas. The UK doesn't head it. ---------- Post added 09-10-2013 at 22:29 ---------- I don't think you've understood me, I'm asking how could a mere constituent part(Britain) of a state(a federal Europe) be the head of a commonwealth of other countries. ---------- Post added 09-10-2013 at 22:21 ---------- I agree with you, and I'm not saying the commonwealth is a reason for getting out, I'm saying its a big reason why we can't go whole hog into the EU, ie, join the Euro and poitically and fiscally merge with the rest of Europe, in effect getting enveloped by it and becoming a mere constituent part of it. We'll never join the Euro and we'll never fully integrate politically. Those lines are drawn in the sand as far as the majority of Britons are concerned and it's on that premise that Cameron wants to renegotiate. Despite his heavy handedness he has read the public mood correctly, better than Miliband and Clegg have. The challenge he has now is selling a continued membership based on a rebalancing towards the needs of individual member states. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeMaquis Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 I don't think you've understood me, I'm asking how could a mere constituent part(Britain) of a state(a federal Europe) be the head of a commonwealth of other countries. Oh dear. You're the one not doing the understanding. Britain is not Head of the Commonwealth. No state is. ".... the Commonwealth is a voluntary association of independent and equal sovereign states, each responsible for its own policies, consulting and co-operating in the common interests of our peoples...... http://thecommonwealth.org/our-charter The EU isn't federal either. And there collapses your argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southcoast Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 Oh dear. You're the one not doing the understanding. Britain is not Head of the Commonwealth. No state is. ".... the Commonwealth is a voluntary association of independent and equal sovereign states, each responsible for its own policies, consulting and co-operating in the common interests of our peoples...... http://thecommonwealth.org/our-charter The EU isn't federal either. And there collapses your argument. Not yet it isnt but thats the goal,its for closer and closer integration and those like you who pretend it isnt are deceiving the people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeMaquis Posted October 9, 2013 Share Posted October 9, 2013 Not yet it isnt but thats the goal,its for closer and closer integration and those like you who pretend it isnt are deceiving the people. I'm not claiming some states don't have a federal goal but it would be a two-speed Europe with some states in and some states out of federalism. But I think what you really don't like is that it doesn't offer us your beloved National Socialism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.