mikeye Posted October 17, 2013 Share Posted October 17, 2013 What planet do you live on? I bet you enjoy this forum because out in the real world your opinions are deluded. It's just trolling. He doesn't believe any of it, IMO... I mean who could?.. ---------- Post added 17-10-2013 at 15:31 ---------- I'm saying bringing in low paid immigrants is a false economy. We need to deal with the issues you point out instead of bringing in short-term solutions with long-term consequences. We have a duty of care to our OAP's but we do not for would-be immigrants. If we want to turn them away because they will be a financial drain then we can... they aren't our responsibility. ---------- Post added 17-10-2013 at 15:06 ---------- It is because times have changed. There was no welfare system,benefits, free health care, free legal services etc, etc. The immigrants stood on their own two feet or fell. No drain on society when they failed and contribution when they succeeded. Simple enough? Perhaps you want to think a little before hurling insults... it makes you look like a fool. I do sometimes wonder why you bother. No matter how much evidence and reasonable dialogue you present you'll just get abuse and denial in response. Credit to you though. Don't let the haters win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chalga Posted October 17, 2013 Share Posted October 17, 2013 I'm saying bringing in low paid immigrants is a false economy. We need to deal with the issues you point out instead of bringing in short-term solutions with long-term consequences. We have a duty of care to our OAP's but we do not for would-be immigrants. If we want to turn them away because they will be a financial drain then we can... they aren't our responsibility. ---------- Post added 17-10-2013 at 15:06 ---------- If immigrants pass the Habitual Residence and the Right To Reside in the UK tests,then they don't get turned away,they will most likely have jobs and be able to support themselves so they will not be a drain.if they fulfill the criteria set out by the UK Government, they may be legitimately entitled to claim UK benefits after a period of time.Later,they may become British Citizens and qualify for a pension.........they become the responsibility of the UK,and especially where,as in the case of NHS workers,they have been specifically recruited by the UK,asked and invited to come,and if this need for workers like this continues they may well have their contracts extended for years and years and become British Citizens,just like millions of 'would be' immigrants already have done over the last few decades,these will be 'our responsibilty',because they will be British. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zamo Posted October 17, 2013 Share Posted October 17, 2013 If immigrants pass the Habitual Residence and the Right To Reside in the UK tests,then they don't get turned away,they will most likely have jobs and be able to support themselves so they will not be a drain.if they fulfill the criteria set out by the UK Government, they may be legitimately entitled to claim UK benefits after a period of time.Later,they may become British Citizens and qualify for a pension.........they become the responsibility of the UK,and especially where,as in the case of NHS workers,they have been specifically recruited by the UK,asked and invited to come,and if this need for workers like this continues they may well have their contracts extended for years and years and become British Citizens,just like millions of 'would be' immigrants already have done over the last few decades,these will be 'our responsibilty',because they will be British. Indeed. That is why we need to change policies and controls so they don't enter the country and don't become our responsibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chalga Posted October 17, 2013 Share Posted October 17, 2013 Indeed. That is why we need to change policies and controls so they don't enter the country and don't become our responsibility. And the only way to do that is to leave the EU.Even if and when that happens,there will still be immigrants,UK business and the skills and labour shortage in some public services will see to that,plus demographics in the home grown UK population like ageing and the UK brain drain.The other policies like the overhaul of the welfare state,universal credit and education and training for young people to be prepared for the jobs market in the areas that are needed by the UK will go hand in hand with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alchresearch Posted October 18, 2013 Share Posted October 18, 2013 More "send 'em back" trouble: Text messages asked wrong people if they were illegal immigrants, officials say http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-24575795 The BBC were loving this on Breakfast news this morning, laying into the Home Office. Then we found out the messages were sent by Capita. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeMaquis Posted October 18, 2013 Share Posted October 18, 2013 Folk emigrated to the USA in centuries gone by to work and try to make money. Folk emigrate to the present-day UK to grow fat off benefits. So there hasn't been any immigration to the USA since centuries gone by? Of course. "The number of immigrants (legal and illegal) in the country hit a new record of 40 million in 2010, a 28 percent increase over the total in 2000". http://www.cis.org/2012-profile-of-americas-foreign-born-population ---------- Post added 18-10-2013 at 10:44 ---------- It is because times have changed. There was no welfare system,benefits, free health care, free legal services etc, etc. The immigrants stood on their own two feet or fell. No drain on society when they failed and contribution when they succeeded. Simple enough? Perhaps you want to think a little before hurling insults... it makes you look like a fool. See above for evidence that migrants are still flocking to the USA. Simple enough? Perhaps you want to think a little before getting your facts wrong... it makes you look like a fool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zamo Posted October 18, 2013 Share Posted October 18, 2013 See above for evidence that migrants are still flocking to the USA. Simple enough? Perhaps you want to think a little before getting your facts wrong... it makes you look like a fool. When did I say immigrants were not still flocking to the USA? You said the world largest economy was built on immigration, which I conceded was true but beside the point because it was done over centuries when benefits, free-health care, free legal services etc, etc didn't exist. Therefore, poor immigrants didn't damage the wealth of the nation. You are clearly confused. The USA remains the worlds largest economy despite poor immigrants and not because of them. Here are some figures from the link you provided: In 2010, 23 percent of immigrants and their U.S.-born children (under 18 ) lived in poverty, compared to 13.5 percent of natives and their children. Immigrants and their children accounted for one-fourth of all persons in poverty. The children of immigrants account for one-third of all children in poverty. In 2010, 36 percent of immigrant-headed households used at least one major welfare program (primarily food assistance and Medicaid) compared to 23 percent of native households. Many immigrants make significant progress the longer they live in the country. However, on average even immigrants who have lived in the United States for 20 years have not come close to closing the gap with natives. The poverty rate of adult immigrants who have lived in the United States for 20 years is 50 percent higher than that of adult natives. Your 'evidence' show that over a third of immigrants are in poverty and use at least one major welfare program. Do you really think that it is those people that are the backbone of the worlds strongest economy? No, they make the nation poor and the USA would be stronger without them. Thanks for taking the time to prove my points. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyfriday Posted October 18, 2013 Share Posted October 18, 2013 We have a duty of care to our OAP's but we do not for would-be immigrants. Which ironically, given the effects of the ageing population, is one of the best reasons for championing immigration! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zamo Posted October 18, 2013 Share Posted October 18, 2013 Which ironically, given the effects of the ageing population, is one of the best reasons for championing immigration! Only immigration that makes us wealthier will help and the rest we need to try and prevent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyfriday Posted October 18, 2013 Share Posted October 18, 2013 Only immigration that makes us wealthier will help and the rest we need to try and prevent. Who's going to be changing your catheter in old age Zamo when your waist deep in your own pee? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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