SqueakyPete Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 too right carol , that mr M is a pinko do goodie isn't he - the real question is whether we should start getting 'rough' with the baddies & no rational person could argue with that. note - in 1672 when 'hung drawn and quartered' was ended and replaced with just hanging, the murder rate rose by nearly 400% in 3 years. when torture was abolished the confession rate dropped by about 80% OVERNIGHT - When deportation to australia ended, the crime rate in aus plummeted and ours rocketed. The murder rate in the UK is now the 6th highest in the world - it's time to stop pussy footing and GET REAL 6th highest? Where did you pull that figure from? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frank ryan Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 6th highest? Where did you pull that figure from? I made it up, where do you think - we live in one of the safest, least violent urbanized societies in the world, the firearm death rate is close to zero, and 500 people a year die by homicide. not as low as japan where violence is almost non existent as it is in Norway. I also have no idea when drawing and quartering were abolished or the effect on the crime rate, it and the other examples were used as what is called 'a joke'. however, being a soft livered pinko leftie, I oppose hanging drawing and quartering or any combination of them. my assertion that the confession rate dropped when torture was abolished is ,I guess, accurate. the established 'western' countries tend to have an average intentional homicide rate of 1 per 100,000 - '1' means 0-1.5 ,'2' = 1.5 - 2.5 etc , we are around 0.9/1.0. the USA which has capital punishment, whole life sentences, harsh police methods etc has a rate of 5, the highest in western countries. Guns? - Canada is equally tooled up but they shoot Elks not Canadians - the answer to violent crime isn't building gallows or birching stocks, it's in the nature of the society & the cultures within it. In my humble opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willman Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 What do we think birching will achieve? It won't stop knife carrying, criminalising some behaviour makes people do it more, just ask the drug users and supporters on here. Not all knife carriers just like not all drug users are a risk to the public. Some knife carriers carry them ;cos they want too. So if as a "community" we did the right thing - report people who threaten others and stand up as witnesses instead of hoping for someone else to do the job justice might prevail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mister M Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 Here we go again!............lets turn the thread into a different subject to suit the posters leftie ideology. I wasn't turning the thread into a different one, I was placing the Frank Ryan's contribution in a wider context, which is perfectly legitimate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frank ryan Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 I wasn't turning the thread into a different one, I was placing the Frank Ryan's contribution in a wider context, which is perfectly legitimate. my contributions generally need a wider context, especially when I'm drunk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinfoilhat Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 I made it up, where do you think - we live in one of the safest, least violent urbanized societies in the world, the firearm death rate is close to zero, and 500 people a year die by homicide. not as low as japan where violence is almost non existent as it is in Norway. I also have no idea when drawing and quartering were abolished or the effect on the crime rate, it and the other examples were used as what is called 'a joke'. however, being a soft livered pinko leftie, I oppose hanging drawing and quartering or any combination of them. my assertion that the confession rate dropped when torture was abolished is ,I guess, accurate. the established 'western' countries tend to have an average intentional homicide rate of 1 per 100,000 - '1' means 0-1.5 ,'2' = 1.5 - 2.5 etc , we are around 0.9/1.0. the USA which has capital punishment, whole life sentences, harsh police methods etc has a rate of 5, the highest in western countries. Guns? - Canada is equally tooled up but they shoot Elks not Canadians - the answer to violent crime isn't building gallows or birching stocks, it's in the nature of the society & the cultures within it. In my humble opinion. America, despite its hard line (unless you're rich obviously) leads the world in number of incarcerated citizens per capita. Their prisons are NOT holiday camps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frank ryan Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 America, despite its hard line (unless you're rich obviously) leads the world in number of incarcerated citizens per capita. Their prisons are NOT holiday camps. that's my point tinny, despite the draconian nature of their penal system, their citizens keep on killing and maiming each other, so it doesn't work. so we shouldn't copy it. our criminal justice system is draconian compared to other similar countries with near identical violent crime rates, so whatever determines the crime rate, it isn't that. we imprison more for lesser crimes than other euro countries, we are not a pink liberal country, our penal system is more closely related to turkey than france. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L00b Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 we imprison more for lesser crimes than other euro countries, we are not a pink liberal country, our penal system is more closely related to turkey than france.I happen to know a fair bit about both (respective penal systems of Turkey and France), so can I please ask you for some evidence of this comparison? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinfoilhat Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 I happen to know a fair bit about both (respective penal systems of Turkey and France), so can I please ask you for some evidence of this comparison? I read somewhere that half of all court cases are due to non payment of tv licenses. It was on the bbc site a while ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L00b Posted October 30, 2013 Share Posted October 30, 2013 I read somewhere that half of all court cases are due to non payment of tv licenses. It was on the bbc site a while ago.Sorry tfh, not with you yet...how is that connected to my post? Alright, did I just miss a sarky point that went right over my head? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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