Will self on the hijab

[Nagel]

IN fact the Qur'an DOES tell men that they should be covered, modestly. Both men and women are instructed to cover that which is precious, (ie what you would not normally "display", so for women, the bosom and private area, and for men, their private area. for men it's navel to knee, at least, and for women, bosom to knee)

 

It's not actually mandatory that the face be covered, it's the head/ hair that is meant to be covered. And, as Boyfriday has said, above, the three Abrahamic religions all have instruction that the woman's hair be covered. Most frohm (observant) Jewish women wear a scarf or wig ( a "Shteitl"), and the Christian woman is also told to cover her head.

 

 

Again, we aren't told to cover our faces.

 

The rules about performing the Muslim Pilgrimage, or "Hajj" are that the woman cannot wear niqaab (face veil)whiclst performing Hajj.

I may stand to be corrected here, but also the requirement for prayer is that the woman praying must cover herself except for her face and hands (Some schools also permit bare feet) the man must be covered from neck to ankle to wrist, some also wear the prayer cap.

 

 

 

Some women do take the concept of covering to a further degree, by covering the face. Here in the west, thankfully, it's usually by choice, and not something forced on them.

 

 

I don't get the Islamic obsession with discussing the minutiae of the rules of the religion. It all appears quite bonkers to someone who doesn't believe.

 

Whatever happened to the idea that 'rules are made to be broken'?

[mafya]

It has everything to do with the twaddle you posted.

 

http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http://www.heritageofscotland.com/pictures/pic44fd9bfa4aacf.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.heritageofscotland.com/cid,,pid,35,package.php&h=320&w=240&sz=15&tbnid=NgYrHBqxvhu4sM:&tbnh=91&tbnw=68&zoom=1&usg=__WGMqYxji8dYUkjQZ9AoAxbmvsU0=&docid=x0qCN1nVw_veUM&sa=X&ei=_qWHUtyyIsfLhAez74CQBA&ved=0CDAQ9QEwAA

 

 

HELLO>>>>>Look at the link..IDIOT.

 

Don't call me an idiot as I can also chuck insults about you little twerp!

The op is about someone's opinion about the hijab and not about non Muslims being made to cover their heads or faces in backwards Muslim countries as you so eloquently put it.

[ronthenekred]

Its quite worrying that some seem to think he's in any way right.

 

It's quite worrying that you've invented something which doesn't exist. The only post I see which relates to "right or wrong" was tinfoil when he says he agrees and disagrees with WS. I'm assuming tinfoil was talking generally about the man.

 

Like tinfoil I agree and disagree with his thoughts and opinions. Obviously an intelligent man, but "gormless"? coming from someone who sees toilet humour as a preference? If that's the depths of your reading capacity then who am I to question it.

[Plain Talker]

I don't get the Islamic obsession with discussing the minutiae of the rules of the religion. It all appears quite bonkers to someone who doesn't believe.

 

Whatever happened to the idea that 'rules are made to be broken'?

 

you get other religions which also focus on minutiae. how many angels can fit on a pinhead for example.

[angos]

(My bold) no, I'm not saying that being blind is not a disability:- I'm saying that the concept that a blind person can't tell if they are being lied to does them a disservice, and using that same logic, as applied to the woman in a niqaab, is wrong.

 

and I won't deign to deal with the other points, about who did or didn't write the scriptures, and whether it was man or God, as that's a lengthy debate and a subjective one where the answer will never be thrashed out to the satisfaction of all, in this life.

 

If I blindfolded you it would impair your ability to recognise a lie, if you wear the blindfold for years you may develop other skills to help you compensate for your lack of vision. I jury unable to see the witness doesn't have the time to develop news skills, and many people rely on facial expression to detect lies.

 

While interviewing the suspect.

As the suspect prepares to answer, he looks up and to the left, purses his lips, tenses his eyelids, and brings his eyebrows down.

 

The FBI investigator knows that a suspect displaying shifty eyes and gaze aversion and looking up and to the left when answering uncomfortable questions is exhibiting signs of lying.

[boyfriday]

Seem like there's a tradition on Sheffield Forum for Mellthebell to start fire stoking threads and the same old loonies to humour him with the same old rubbish over and over again.

Enough already.

 

Mellthebell, end it.

 

Im not sure why you quote my post whilst making that comment, mine was simply a statement of fact.

 

---------- Post added 17-11-2013 at 08:39 ----------

 

I don't think it is a choice freely entered into, in parts of Afghanistan, Somalia, Sudan etc. it's a bit different here - I think some women wear the veil because it's a bit controversial and to draw attention to themselves - nothing to do with modesty really!

 

In my view it doesn't matter what their reasons are for wearing it-modesty, to be a bit controversial, because they're scared of the cold, it doesn't matter two hoots for the same reason I wouldn't care why someone is heavily tattooed or pierced-all are anachronistic to me but it's not my business to interfere really.

 

---------- Post added 17-11-2013 at 08:48 ----------

 

They live in a parallel universe to real people.

 

Quite true and quite willingly.

[WeX]

There's a tradition in all Abrahamic religions (including Christianity) that women cover their heads. As well as Muslim women, Catholic and Jewish women continue to follow that custom to varying degrees.

 

This is what Corinthians says

 

Its simply about numbers. How many christian women do you see following this rule? What about other silly rules in the Bible? Are they all followed? Nope, because Christians have the maturity of faith to recognise incompatible teachings. You are not refused entry to a Church for having tattoos these days are you. Muslims on the other hand see the Quran as the word of god that cannot be changed, and this is the reason why their religion resides in the dark ages. Those who try to change the religion for the better or leave because of its antiquated ways are met with aggression.

 

I suppose the question you need to ask yourself is, when was the last Christian women you saw covered head to toe in something like a Burka?

 

These two articles have a lot of information on head coverings in both Christianity and Islam.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hijab_by_country

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_headcovering

 

What I will say is this. We have every right to challenge what we see as oppression of women by a culture that is imported to this country. It is offensive to see others told what to wear by their male counterparts. Women fought for their rights to equality in the UK not that long ago and this form of patriarchy allows women to be subjugated by men within their communities.

[boyfriday]

Its simply about numbers. How many christian women do you see following this rule? What about other silly rules in the Bible? Are they all followed? Nope, because Christians have the maturity of faith to recognise incompatible teachings. You are not refused entry to a Church for having tattoos these days are you. Muslims on the other hand see the Quran as the word of god that cannot be changed, and this is the reason why their religion resides in the dark ages. Those who try to change the religion for the better or leave because of its antiquated ways are met with aggression.

 

I suppose the question you need to ask yourself is, when was the last Christian women you saw covered head to toe in something like a Burka?

 

These two articles have a lot of information on head coverings in both Christianity and Islam.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hijab_by_country

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_headcovering

 

I was simply answering a question posed by another poster Wex.

What I will say is this. We have every right to challenge what we see as oppression of women by a culture that is imported to this country.

Breast enhancements-do you challenge those?

It is offensive to see others told what to wear by their male counterparts.

So you want to replace one form of oppression with another?

Women fought for their rights to equality in the UK not that long ago and this form of patriarchy allows women to be subjugated by men within their communities.

Presumably those rights extend to what they want to wear too?

 

Perhaps you could explain how the subjugation of Muslim women is going to be addressed by telling them what you find acceptable what they wear? Don't you think it's the attitude of those men who subjugate that should be challenged?

[Guest]

Muslims on the other hand see the Quran as the word of god that cannot be changed, and this is the reason why their religion resides in the dark ages. Those who try to change the religion for the better or leave because of its antiquated ways are met with aggression.

 

That is simply your (incorrect) view.

 

The Qu'ran does not force anyone to do anything and leaves the choice to the individual- so stop making up what you only perceive to be 'true' (i.e. see some Muslims doing something and think; THAT IS ISLAM).

 

What does the Qu'ran actually say?

 

There is no compulsion in religion. 2:256

 

Whosoever will, let him believe, and whosoever will, let him disbelieve. 18:29

 

Unto you your religion, and unto me my religion. 109:6

 

 

 

I suppose the question you need to ask yourself is, when was the last Christian women you saw covered head to toe in something like a Burka?

 

Err..nuns?

 

 

What I will say is this. We have every right to challenge what we see as oppression of women by a culture that is imported to this country. It is offensive to see others told what to wear by their male counterparts. Women fought for their rights to equality in the UK not that long ago and this form of patriarchy allows women to be subjugated by men within their communities.

 

Why do you regard your point of view or that of a particular society as the criterion for judging other societies or people?

 

Many Western born and educated Muslim women observe an Islamic dress- what they see as their view of how modesty is or ought to be. Just go to a few Universities and see for yourself- are these young educated girls forced to wear the modest coverings?

 

Why don't you go and conduct a survey- ask them. Oh yeah- and one more thing, they are not all brown skinned..

[melthebell]

Seem like there's a tradition on Sheffield Forum for Mellthebell to start fire stoking threads and the same old loonies to humour him with the same old rubbish over and over again.

Enough already.

 

Mellthebell, end it.

 

who put you in charge?