The New Moor Market

[BoroB]

1. Sorry I misread your earlier post. I thought you were referring to empty stalls and not weeks since opening.

2. Think it will be my post that made the 95% occupancy rate. It may be the 95% occupancy rate is expected to be hit x years after opening. I'd have to see the documents and business plan.

3. Any planner worth their salt would prepare on the basis of events that would be foreseeable. That means they would know a clear picture could not be formed till some time past the opening date. Most new businesses take 3-5 years to establish themselves. there are always costs associated with opening a new business.

 

We simply dont know whats happened about the take up and whether market management are telling the truth, its them and not really the council.

 

Its to hope that it does become a success not least so that Sheffield's council tax payers are not left to subsidise a half empty market hall.

 

Personally I'm not convinced it will become a success because peoples shopping habits have changed since the 1970's when I was taken to the very busy Sheaf/Castle markets every week by my parents.

 

The reason a lot of people did not go to the Castle Market is not because it was in a run down state but because they can get all their shopping needs in the evenings at a supermarket offering free parking a lot closer to home. The new market will not change this routine for a lot of people.

[cuttsie]

Cuttsie you are silly. The whole bottom floor was deserted. the Old market was losing an estimated £1m a year and it was getting worse. have you thought about breaking back in and reopening the market as a squatter?

I know I am silly Trigger as you keep telling me so.

As to the basement floor in the Castle I always said it wanted closing down and converting into a Gym or Night club, and even then the Ground floor plus the Fish Market would have been more successful than the new one will ever be also BIGGER.

I see that the Management have been telling all and sundry that a million people have passed through the doors at the new Mini Market well I will bet Nuffields Millions that just as many would have gone through the doors at the Castle over the three month Xmas period.

At half the rent to the stallholders as well.

[999tigger]

1. They were losing more money on castle market.

2. changing shopping habits are seomthing ive pointed out throughtout this thread. Talk to cuttsie.

3. they wnat it to be soemething like Borough market in London. Higher quality, higher profit margin destination place. Will require a lot of change, meaning some have to go out of business.

http://boroughmarket.org.uk/

Sheffield has some great little shops though.

 

---------- Post added 08-03-2014 at 15:35 ----------

 

I know I am silly Trigger as you keep telling me so.

As to the basement floor in the Castle I always said it wanted closing down and converting into a Gym or Night club, and even then the Ground floor plus the Fish Market would have been more successful than the new one will ever be also BIGGER.

I see that the Management have been telling all and sundry that a million people have passed through the doors at the new Mini Market well I will bet Nuffields Millions that just as many would have gone through the doors at the Castle over the three month Xmas period.

At half the rent to the stallholders as well.

 

Half the rent to the stallholders, but bigger losses to the council.

 

Dude just accpet what people say on this thread a lot of them just prefer to shop in a different way. If castle market had been a raging success then they wouldnt have closed it. People shop in different ways , not sure why you find thats so hard to accept.

[Uptowngirl]

 

The reason a lot of people did not go to the Castle Market is not because it was in a run down state but because they can get all their shopping needs in the evenings at a supermarket offering free parking a lot closer to home. The new market will not change this routine for a lot of people.

 

You mustn't go saying things like that. It seems to be a hanging offense in Sheffield to use the "C" word.

[discodown]

Why would it be fresher. Can a trader in Sheffield market get his bananas from Grenada any quicker than Corkers or Sainsbury? I don't think so.

No but they don't have to order them from a central depot like Sainsburys do either. They just get them straight from the wholesaler and sell them to the customer unlike a supermarket which tends to have another layer of distribution

[Uptowngirl]

I see that the Management have been telling all and sundry that a million people have passed through the doors at the new Mini Market

 

I'm sure they did. But equally half of them didn't spend a bean. Many of them went for a nosey and probably won't return. That's the difference at the supermarket. If a million folk go in 99000 buy something. Not only that. I suspect the average shopper spent no more than £10 in the market where the average shopper in a supermarket spends nearer £50.

[salsafan]

Why would it be fresher. Can a trader in Sheffield market get his bananas from Grenada any quicker than Corkers or Sainsbury? I don't think so.

 

Like you say a grocer, butcher, baker could set up a stall in a supermarket and offer perceived fresher goods if that were the case. At least that would offer a car park and a convenient way of getting your goods home.

 

---------- Post added 08-03-2014 at 14:04 ----------

 

 

I suppose you don't have to hump nails or a hair cut back to a car in dirty great heavy bags.

A supermarket will sign itself to a contract to get certain supplies. A local market is that bit freer to get any stock, and that can include small local stock as well as oversea stock of lower units. The supermarkets may ship bulk, but then there is the wholesale market who tries to shift goods at a quicker pace, and this is whereby a decent specialist in its category is both an actual buyer with specialist knowledge, and then also a discerning business person too.

 

That is what I would rely on in a local market, and they know this. The really older buyers/specialists know this kind of thing. Even as a foodie, I know this, and I know when the stock is frozen or not. You just know. Do you know why Waitrose and M&S is gaining more market shares? It is because they have signed some of the local farms, and therefore can reduce the time to market time and therefore be that fresher in quality.

 

To be honest, I do prefer some of the shopkeepers in London because they know their stock and the quality. Just like Ozman in London Road, he knows his food and knows whether something is buyable or not. I wish the market in the city centre can get in on this kind of game. Because people from all over the place go to Ozman, and why is that so ? Don't you wonder about that ?

 

Plus, the "deli" is making a come back. So what is the difference between a deli to that of a local market? They can still stock the same thing too. You just need to know your selling point, and what to draw people in for. If a shop in the market stock fairly reasonable items, as well as the variety as that from a deli, I would also frequent this too.

 

To be honest, I do not drive, and I have carried around 10+kg of food before home on the bus! But do I want to continually subject my body to that ? No. I do travel a lot for my job, so any bit of luxury like home delivery is absolutely fine with me.

 

---------- Post added 08-03-2014 at 15:59 ----------

 

Its to hope that it does become a success not least so that Sheffield's council tax payers are not left to subsidise a half empty market hall.

 

Personally I'm not convinced it will become a success because peoples shopping habits have changed since the 1970's when I was taken to the very busy Sheaf/Castle markets every week by my parents.

 

The reason a lot of people did not go to the Castle Market is not because it was in a run down state but because they can get all their shopping needs in the evenings at a supermarket offering free parking a lot closer to home. The new market will not change this routine for a lot of people.

I was the same too. I had to help my parents shop. But then again, this was not a bad thing as such because it meant that I learnt how to be responsible as well as learning about food and what is fresh or not. So it surprises me when Jamie Oliver turned the nation into a mockery and a circus, I was doubly surprised !Maybe he caught that bit of a gap whereby school dinners were just finished and fast foods were introduced to please the children. It really shows that the school should indeed have a tight control over its food production. It also shows how badly run some schools were in meals.

 

I wonder if there can be a technology to introduce some kind of supply-chain aimed for home deliveries, and this will reduce the heavy carrying, and if this is done successfully and in some manner, then this "social enterprise" or whatever can take off and mimic'd across onto other cities. Hey... now there is a business proposal.

[999tigger]

I'm sure they did. But equally half of them didn't spend a bean. Many of them went for a nosey and probably won't return. That's the difference at the supermarket. If a million folk go in 99000 buy something. Not only that. I suspect the average shopper spent no more than £10 in the market where the average shopper in a supermarket spends nearer £50.

 

Based on your suspicions?

 

Lots of people just pass through.

 

Count next time you are at the checkout or self service and see if they have £50 worth of goods, bet its much lower.

 

shamed by using the DM http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-2204502/Mothers-make-19-trips-supermarket-month.html

 

Expect people dont just do the weekly shop anymore and its one shop plus plenty of small trips to smaller supermarkets.

Edited March 8, 2014 by 999tigger

[salsafan]

If the rent is around 20-30k per year, then this is quite ridiculous. Even if they are trying to hold onto the value of the land. This is whereby it is one of those situation that the "regeneration" phase could and only could happen during a specific time, and when these proposals happened, the council added and nailed that coffin on top and killed of the business flow within a city when the economy was going downhill anyhow. That_was_not_good !!

[Uptowngirl]

Based on your suspicions?

 

Lots of people just pass through.

 

Count next time you are at the checkout or self service and see if they have £50 worth of goods, bet its much lower.

 

 

No based on observations. I like thousands of others popped into the new market to take a peek. And like many of the others who were there in the first few weeks I took a peek and walked out without spending anything. Now it seems that things have settled down. I'm sure most who go now do go to buy. But those numbers are way way down on the days of the voyuer. So that million who visited included a lot of folks just curious to see what it was like.

 

You might find this interesting.

 

http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/bills/article-2233309/British-shoppers-overspend-30-supermarkets.html

 

It seems that the average person spends nearly £30 on items that they hadn't intended buying when they visit a supermarket.

 

"The decline of the shopping list coupled with supermarkets’ tricks to encourage impulse buying is causing overspending British shoppers to splash out almost £30 more each trip, a study has claimed.

 

A third of Britons have no budget in mind when they do their supermarket shop, while those that do tend to overspend by on average £27.42 on each visit, a survey of 2,000 shoppers by YouGov has found"

"Apparently, men are more likely to overspend in the aisles than woman, the research found, with men splurging an extra £29.64 over their budget per shop, while women spend an extra £25.72.

 

The biggest overspender is likely to be a married man, aged between 35 and 44 working full-time, and living in the Midlands with two children.

Edited March 8, 2014 by Uptowngirl