The New Moor Market

[Scabbydog]

This is a charming reply, but a flight of fancy, don't you agree?

If you were going to Manchester with wool, you would not have walked , but hired or bought a beast of burden and followed the ancient packhorse trails over the Peaks.

Markets are and should be primarily for people who can walk home with their goods.

On the issues of airport (which I flew from, making me a real Stone Ager) and ski slope, I am with you entirely.

 

Actually my many greats grandfather did exactly that. Walking with a bale of cloth 200 years ago. He was murdered on the way home for his purse. Their is still a stone at the side of the road commemorating the event.

 

http://www.stevelewis.me.uk/page64.php

Edited April 28, 2014 by Scabbydog

[Ela James]

I went for a visit and check ( ie little research!) the other day, had a chat with 2 or 3 people running different businesses …., frankly it felt very risky

[boldforester]

CM couldn't have been modernised for any reasonable money. There were too many stairs. It'd need demolishing & replacing to make it more accessible, disability discrimination act & all that.

 

My mum struggled to get round it & there was no chance my grandma could get round to do her shopping. Now we can even push my dad around the new market in his wheelchair. I'm not sure why they don't let blue badge holders park right next to it though.

 

Teapots? What is this?

[BoroB]

Correct but it's not uncommon for new businesses to have a 3 and 5 year plan in which to establish themselves. Any reasonable business plan would have taken all this into account.

 

To break even they need a 94% occupancy rate. The council will be losing less money on 80% occupancy than they would be at Castle Market.

 

I understand new businesses take time to become established but empty units in a free rent period does not bode well in the short to medium term.

 

No doubt the council has a business plan but having heard them constantly say that there is a waiting list for units in a market with empty stalls you can understand why people are concerned with the management of the market.

 

Can you explain why the council will be losing less money on a new build market upon which substantial borrowings have been secured rather than the Castle Market?

[boldforester]

Think you are being unreasonable with boldforester. He has simply said the Town centre has developed in such a way that the market has not been at the centre. Because it is a central location, then property prices are at a premium.

 

There are plenty of car parks within a short distance of the current market, but the issue seems to be over 50p an hour for city centre parking being too expensive.

 

Many people are unreasonable with me!! I went out on a limb over the Joanna Dennehy business; didn't expect the Spanish Inquisition (who does?)

[999tigger]

I wasn't being unreasonable with boldforester I was agreeing with most of what he said and my criticism was aimed towards the council. But then the usual council excuse makers jumped in to tell us we were all wrong in wanting to use our cars.

 

Im not a council excuse maker if you are trying to suggest so.

You arent wrong in wanting to use your cars.

 

It has been pointed out theres plenty of car parking spaces around the market so its a fallacy to say there arent.

 

---------- Post added 28-04-2014 at 11:22 ----------

 

Castle Market was already built, paid for & they never did much maintenance. Can't see how it was really losing money. If Sheffield Council could keep their own website online I might have a chance to estimate occupancy rates. Even if it's just 20% empty, it's still a lot, what's that ~40 empty stalls? At least 5 stalls have gone since the market opened & one of those occupied two pitches.

 

You know one way you could find out how many empty stalls there are is by actually going to the market and counting them. It doesnt take long. You can also walk up the Moor and count the empty units and then youd get an accurate number.

 

The last time I counted a few weeks ago it was 21 units (Most stalls take 2 units), the fish stall and four in the food area. That included the ones who had ceased trading. I will recount so you have an accurate figure. There is a big difference between claiming half empty i.e 50% and 80% or claiming empty when in fact there are shops there.

[anywebsite]

There's TM Meats gone too since then. Juicy Patties & the kebab stall have gone from the cafe area as well now. If you want to quibble over numbers then go down & count, buy something while your there too, help another stall stay open, they need it & apparently it's weeks since your last visit. 'Half' wasn't intended to mean 'exactly 50%', but I'm not about to stop you being pedantic, maybe you could add to the poor footfall. If you go midweek you'll see the occupied stalls that don't bother to open every day too.

Edited April 28, 2014 by anywebsite

[mondeo blade]

the new market is a big disappointment it stinks of fish and very unfriendly for wheelchair users .I use to go 3/4 week now I don't go any more

[Scabbydog]

I understand new businesses take time to become established but empty units in a free rent period does not bode well in the short to medium term.

 

No doubt the council has a business plan but having heard them constantly say that there is a waiting list for units in a market with empty stalls you can understand why people are concerned with the management of the market.

 

Can you explain why the council will be losing less money on a new build market upon which substantial borrowings have been secured rather than the Castle Market?

Folks can park for free, and shop more conveniently at supermarkets or Meadowhall. If the want to shop in markets they can park cheaper or for free at many other markets around the area. The other markets like Bakewell and Chesterfield have a great feel to them, being part of the structure that the towns were built around.

But nothing puts customers off a place more than seeing empty stalls. You can go to Chesterfield on non market days. A few folk will have set up as day traders but the place feels dead.

But you hit the nail on the head with the $64,000 question. How does the council expect to fill the empty stalls if they couldn't do it when they were rent free?

So if the council's business plan was any good they would have ensured that all stalls were taken on day 1. If that meant letting them out for free to day traders so be it. Now the novelty of a new market has worn off folks have memories of empty stalls, inconvenient parking, and no atmosphere. If those customers can't be persuaded to return and produce the promised brochure footfall there won't be queues wanting to open stalls even if the rent free period is extended.

 

WHITE ELEPHANT... Don Valley Stadium RIP. Sheffield Airport RIP. Sheffield Ski Village RIP. Sheffield Market RIP?

 

---------- Post added 28-04-2014 at 11:52 ----------

 

Im not a council excuse maker if you are trying to suggest so.

You arent wrong in wanting to use your cars.

 

It has been pointed out theres plenty of car parking spaces around the market so its a fallacy to say there arent.

 

I didn't say there weren't car parks around. I said they were pay car parks that weren't convenient. Why pay for inconvenience when you can get convenience for free. Why shop in a market that is dying on its feet when you can shop at vibrant markets with less hassle.

I'm off to Chesterfield shortly. I'll park for free. Stroll around a proper market town with cobbled streets and grab a coffee and home made cake in a 300 year old cafe with oak beams and nice waitresses in black pinnies who serve your order at your table.

[999tigger]

There's TM Meats gone too since then. Juicy Patties & the kebab stall have gone from the cafe area as well now. If you want to quibble over numbers then go down & count, buy something while your there too, help another stall stay open, they need it & apparently it's weeks since your last visit. 'Half' wasn't intended to mean 'exactly 50%', but I'm not about to stop you being pedantic, maybe you could add to the poor footfall. If you go midweek you'll see the occupied stalls that don't bother to open every day too.

 

No its a few weeks since i last counted, not since I last went and shopped there, which was Saturday. Why not just be reasonably accurate and stop saying places are empty when they are not or 50% when its more like 80% because thats just misrepresenting what the situation actually is and undermines the credibility of points you raise.