Cyclone Posted December 15, 2013 Share Posted December 15, 2013 There doesn't seem to be much actual research on the topic, this is about the best I could find. http://blogs.scientificamerican.com/bering-in-mind/2011/03/09/natural-homophobes-evolutionary-psychology-and-antigay-attitudes/ And it's inconclusive at best. Edit - The two evolutionary psychologists agree early on that homophobia is a misnomer as what the word represents is not really a phobia. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angos Posted December 15, 2013 Share Posted December 15, 2013 Cool story. None of it relates to the question I asked though and in no way answers it. Not only that, you've spammed a whole load of bumf about phobias, not homophobia. If you're going argue so much about definitions then we should stick to the correct definition, as provided by yourself earlier... So, once again (again)... MrSmith/Maxmaximus/Angos, how did I not follow logic? (I think at this point it's pretty obvious you don't have an answer or you would have given it pages ago. I'm guessing, from experience, that the huge copy/pastes above are intended to be the point where you say "I've already answered, you just don't understand it" or "I've already answered, I can't help it if it's not what you want to hear" etc, even though, as shown, they do not answer anything) Originally Posted by RootsBooster View Post Getting back to homophobia, you could argue that someone with a rational & non-extreme aversion to homosexuals/homosexuality might not be a bigot, they might not believe that their opinions on homosexuality are superior and they may be open to other peoples' opinions on the matter. Due to the irrational & extreme nature of homophobia though, it would follow logic that a homophobe would believe their opinions on homosexuality to be right and wouldn't accept the differing opinions of others on the matter. This would indeed make them bigots. No it wouldn't, most people that have a phobia know that their phobia is irrational, they are unlikely to even consider the opinions of the people they fear, and there is no reason to think they would feel superior. So no, there is no logical to reason to assume that homophobes are also bigots. ---------- Post added 15-12-2013 at 12:46 ---------- There doesn't seem to be much actual research on the topic, this is about the best I could find. http://blogs.scientificamerican.com/bering-in-mind/2011/03/09/natural-homophobes-evolutionary-psychology-and-antigay-attitudes/ And it's inconclusive at best. Edit - The two evolutionary psychologists agree early on that homophobia is a misnomer as what the word represents is not really a phobia. It's nature, not nurture: personality lies in genes, twins study shows Nature rather than nurture is responsible for creating your personality, according to a study of twins which found that character is something you are born with. Genes play a greater role in determining key personality traits like social skills and learning ability than the way we are brought up by our parents, researchers claimed. The findings contradict the existing belief among psychologists that the environment we grow up in plays a larger role than genetics in shaping our personality. Researchers from Edinburgh University studied more than 800 sets of identical and non-identical twins to learn whether genetics or upbringing has a greater effect on how successful people are in life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael_W Posted December 15, 2013 Share Posted December 15, 2013 It's rather telling of you when you disregard the internet with the roll of the eyes. It's the fairly new medium in which racists, bigots and homophobes ply their wares. At one time they were deemed funny by their contemporaries, now their just seen as morons, even morons don't wish to be labelled morons so they now do it by stealth without a face. Yes, they're all around you tinkering away. Paranoia you may say..nope, it's in Black n White. I also went out, not a thief, sexual predator, mugger, murderer or pervert in sight..I guess I'll content myself they don't exist. Now your making my point for me ron, comparing seeing homophobia with seeing a thief, sexual predator, murderer or pervert .... like I said, it's not that common .... and you yourself said it was mostly an online thing ..... maybe it's just media fed hype and paranoia, like many other things eh Perhaps ron, despite the lack of proof or evidence, maybe the real homophobes do have some genetic issue rather than a learned or taught one ... much like many other hateful people, do you think all murderers etc learn to hate or do some have wiring issues ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RootsBooster Posted December 15, 2013 Share Posted December 15, 2013 No it wouldn't, most people that have a phobia know that their phobia is irrational, they are unlikely to even consider the opinions of the people they fear You're trying to change the definition again, homophobia isn't a fear, it is hatred. We're working with the definition you supplied yourself... Definition Homophobia; An extreme and irrational aversion to homosexuality and homosexual people. also... no reason to think they would feel superior. So no, there is no logical to reason to assume that homophobes are also bigots. I haven't claimed they would feel superior. One of the traits (by definition) of a bigot is that they believe in the superiority of their own opinion, ie they believe their opinion is correct/more important/better than any differing opinions. So, let's try again shall we? Getting back to homophobia, you could argue that someone with a rational & non-extreme aversion to homosexuals/homosexuality might not be a bigot, they might not believe that their opinions on homosexuality are superior and they may be open to other peoples' opinions on the matter. Due to the irrational & extreme nature of homophobia though, it would follow logic that a homophobe would believe their opinions on homosexuality to be right and wouldn't accept the differing opinions of others on the matter. This would indeed make them bigots. How did I not follow logic? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angos Posted December 15, 2013 Share Posted December 15, 2013 You're trying to change the definition again, homophobia isn't a fear, it is hatred. We're working with the definition you supplied yourself... also... I haven't claimed they would feel superior. One of the traits (by definition) of a bigot is that they believe in the superiority of their own opinion, ie they believe their opinion is correct/more important/better than any differing opinions. So, let's try again shall we? How did I not follow logic? It doesn't matter how many times you ask the same question, because there is no logic in your argument, homosexuality isn't an opinion, so being intolerant of homosexuals isn't bigoted. And there is no reason to think homophobic people think their opinion is superior to the opinions of others. Homophobic people have opinions and like everyone else they are entitled to those opinions. If you are intolerant of those opinions and think your opinion is superior, then you are the bigot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dosxuk Posted December 15, 2013 Share Posted December 15, 2013 It doesn't matter how many times you ask the same question, because there is no logic in your argument, homosexuality isn't an opinion, so being intolerant of homosexuals isn't bigoted. And there is no reason to think homophobic people think their opinion is superior to the opinions of others. Homophobic people have opinions and like everyone else they are entitled to those opinions. If you are intolerant of those opinions and think your opinion is superior then you are the bigot. Have you considered stand up comedy as a career? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angos Posted December 15, 2013 Share Posted December 15, 2013 Have you considered stand up comedy as a career? Nope, there are enough comedians on here to keep me amused. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dosxuk Posted December 15, 2013 Share Posted December 15, 2013 Nope, there are enough comedians on here to keep me amused. Shame, you've got natural talent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronthenekred Posted December 15, 2013 Share Posted December 15, 2013 Now your making my point for me ron, comparing seeing homophobia with seeing a thief, sexual predator, murderer or pervert .... like I said, it's not that common .... and you yourself said it was mostly an online thing ..... maybe it's just media fed hype and paranoia, like many other things eh Perhaps ron, despite the lack of proof or evidence, maybe the real homophobes do have some genetic issue rather than a learned or taught one ... much like many other hateful people, do you think all murderers etc learn to hate or do some have wiring issues ? Did you not read my post? The implication I made is, just because you don't encounter racists/bigots down at your local doesn't mean racists and bigots don't exist. Racist, bigots, homophobes, murderers and perverts I would guess all like a drink down at the pub once in a while..their not likely to sing it from the rooftops are they? So no, I'm not making any point in your favour, as you seem to think because you're not tripping over them they are somewhat thin on the ground. I don't need the media to point me to a homophobe to inform me they exist..I know one when I read one simply by what they type. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyclone Posted December 15, 2013 Share Posted December 15, 2013 No it wouldn't, most people that have a phobia know that their phobia is irrational, they are unlikely to even consider the opinions of the people they fear, and there is no reason to think they would feel superior. So no, there is no logical to reason to assume that homophobes are also bigots. ---------- Post added 15-12-2013 at 12:46 ---------- It's nature, not nurture: personality lies in genes, twins study shows Nature rather than nurture is responsible for creating your personality, according to a study of twins which found that character is something you are born with. Genes play a greater role in determining key personality traits like social skills and learning ability than the way we are brought up by our parents, researchers claimed. The findings contradict the existing belief among psychologists that the environment we grow up in plays a larger role than genetics in shaping our personality. Researchers from Edinburgh University studied more than 800 sets of identical and non-identical twins to learn whether genetics or upbringing has a greater effect on how successful people are in life. Does that then claim that homophobia is a personality trait? ---------- Post added 15-12-2013 at 19:10 ---------- It doesn't matter how many times you ask the same question, because there is no logic in your argument, homosexuality isn't an opinion, so being intolerant of homosexuals isn't bigoted. And there is no reason to think homophobic people think their opinion is superior to the opinions of others. Homophobic people have opinions and like everyone else they are entitled to those opinions. If you are intolerant of those opinions and think your opinion is superior, then you are the bigot. The opinion that homosexuality is acceptable is an opinion, homophobes disagree with that opinion, otherwise they wouldn't be homophobes. Duh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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