I1L2T3 Posted December 16, 2013 Share Posted December 16, 2013 Has anyone published a survey comparing the radioactivity of wastes from a coal fired generating plant with a nuclear plant of equal power? I've heard anecdotes that some coal has a measurable radioactivity. Can anyone confirm or deny? The author Jerry Pournelle pointed out that people were afraid of living near a nuclear plant, but not of living down the valley from a big hydro-electric dam. Remember the Sheffield Flood! Fair points. The problem with nuclear is what happens when it goes wrong? Millions are affected and the legacy is very long lived. Nuclear needs to be 100% safe. Bottom line is that it isn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alchresearch Posted December 16, 2013 Share Posted December 16, 2013 Have you seen how many people die in a year around the world in the coal industry due to both long term illnesses and accidents, combine this with the amount of deaths due to pollution and you get an extremely unsafe way of making energy. See, that's the thing. Comparing different methods of generating energy is like playing Top Trumps - one always has a benefit over another. There's no clear outright winner in any of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geared Posted December 16, 2013 Share Posted December 16, 2013 Nuclear accidents always get front page coverage, but I'm willing to bet more people die every year falling off roofs installing solar panels than die from nuclear accidents. It's kind of like flying Vs car travel, Flying is much safer but when it does go wrong it hits the news. People die every minute of every day in car accidents and it doesn't even register. ---------- Post added 16-12-2013 at 11:29 ---------- the problem of disposal and management of the waste. I did read something in the news a month or so ago, where some Scientists in America had developed a nuclear reactor that ran on nuclear waste. All it produced was small amounts of low-level waste so it seemed pretty cool. Install one in a current reactor and you'd solve your waste problem and generate more power at the same time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jmack Posted December 16, 2013 Share Posted December 16, 2013 Aren't they converting Drax from coal to biomass? I read that Drax is going to transform from one of Europes biggest polluters to one of Europes largest Carbon neutral plants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyclone Posted December 16, 2013 Share Posted December 16, 2013 Where did the nuclear fuel come from? Not from the sun. Nor is it currently coming from the sun which is what it ultimately being solar would mean. ---------- Post added 16-12-2013 at 11:54 ---------- Biomass is not really carbon neutral. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I1L2T3 Posted December 16, 2013 Share Posted December 16, 2013 Nuclear accidents always get front page coverage, but I'm willing to bet more people die every year falling off roofs installing solar panels than die from nuclear accidents. It's kind of like flying Vs car travel, Flying is much safer but when it does go wrong it hits the news. People die every minute of every day in car accidents and it doesn't even register. ---------- Post added 16-12-2013 at 11:29 ---------- I did read something in the news a month or so ago, where some Scientists in America had developed a nuclear reactor that ran on nuclear waste. All it produced was small amounts of low-level waste so it seemed pretty cool. Install one in a current reactor and you'd solve your waste problem and generate more power at the same time. You are right that recorded deaths that can be directly attributed to the nuclear industry are low numbers. The point I'm making is about when a nuclear plant fails, melts down. IMO the fact that a vast area can be rendered uninhabitable for generations and the contamination spread over thousands of miles is a totally unacceptable price to pay. Fukushima and Chernobyl won't be the last. It will happen again because plant and systems are old, all across the world. Moving forward obviously the newer reactors look better and safer. Begs the question why is Britain's new one going to use an old design. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeMaquis Posted December 16, 2013 Share Posted December 16, 2013 Nuclear accidents always get front page coverage...... And I think we have a winner for the Most Bleeding Obvious Quote Of The Year Award. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tzijlstra Posted December 16, 2013 Author Share Posted December 16, 2013 I had an interesting chat with a cousin, he was part of the http://www.worldsolarchallenge.org/ winning team some years ago. He, and many others researching and working with renewables, believe that one core issue is the current energy model. We have got used to having electricity, gas and water 'on tap', with it being produced in large quantities in what used to be very efficient plants. He firmly believes that the way forward is that industry and households are made responsible for generating and monitoring their own electricity, either individually or in collectives. There are currently a number of very interesting projects going on in this area and it seems to do two things: It makes people aware of the electricity they use a lot better than just having a monthly bill, resulting in extreme efficiency. And it stimulates cooperation to optimise production. One case he worked on was a small scale development of twelve new houses that were built to be carbon neutral. The project was built with optimal solar performance in mind and they managed to cut electricity usage by 45%, the inhabitants of these houses stated that they simply changed a lot of their patterns and replaced energy inefficient equipment with efficient equipment because they were now aware of how much electricity they produced and how much they used. Of course it has to be noted that they were clearly already well into this, otherwise they wouldn't have bought into the carbon neutral concept. The most interesting thing to happen was that, on their own initiative, they are saving up to put enough money in a collective fund to invest in a wind-turbine, meaning they will be net-contributors rather than net-users for electricity and are planning to save up for a geo-thermal heating system to provide the warm water for the underfloor heating systems they had already built in. Plenty of challenges though, how wonderful it may be, there are plenty of properties out there where this is unachievable. He also mentioned that he has developed a smart-meter that is meant to be put in a visible place, it shows the current energy usage on a large LED screen (you know, the old fashioned red LEDs on a black background). He has this in the kitchen and him and his housemates have already reduced electricity usage by over 15%, simply by tweaking certain things in their behaviour. It is easy to dismiss this as the 'woollen sock/sandal wearing brigade' nonsense, but as the loosely translated adage in the Netherlands goes: "saving the world begins at home." ---------- Post added 16-12-2013 at 12:21 ---------- PS - someone made the point earlier that having solar panels can reduce the value of a house. This was the case in the Netherlands for some time, now however houses that are carbon neutral, or close to carbon neutral in fact sell for a considerable premium. It all relies on educating the population. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truman Posted December 16, 2013 Share Posted December 16, 2013 He also mentioned that he has developed a smart-meter that is meant to be put in a visible place, it shows the current energy usage on a large LED screen (you know, the old fashioned red LEDs on a black background). He has this in the kitchen and him and his housemates have already reduced electricity usage by over 15%, simply by tweaking certain things in their behaviour. Npower sent me something similar for free about 3 years ago.. there's a sensor which clips onto the supply side of the meter and a remote display which it connects to via Bluetooth...it shows current (pardon the pun) use, total use for the day, historic use and also how much the power has cost for the same periods.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tzijlstra Posted December 16, 2013 Author Share Posted December 16, 2013 Npower sent me something similar for free about 3 years ago.. there's a sensor which clips onto the supply side of the meter and a remote display which it connects to via Bluetooth...it shows current (pardon the pun) use, total use for the day, historic use and also how much the power has cost for the same periods.. Yes, I have one of those, but it got used for about two days and then I forgot about it, unplugged it last year. The difference with his is that his basically shouts at you, it is about 20x40 cms. Not sure I would like it in my kitchen, but it is effective! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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