Supertramp Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 Again people are comparing apples and chinese people. WW2 where the US is under direct attack from the Japs and Vietnam where errrr what? I wouldn't serve in no phoney war and refusing to makes you more of a hero than those who just follow orders like idiots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjw47 Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 What never occured to Ali was that his father's generation of black soldiers served in a segregated army yet went overseas to fight the Nazis and the Japs. Had Hitler or the Japanese won Ali would have had a very different existence if indeed an existence at all ---------- Post added 10-01-2014 at 00:02 ---------- Today he would have had the police waiting to take him off the plane when it landed but I guess in first class the alcohol is free and plentiful You are comparing fighting the Nazis, a group who would have brought the entire world under submission given the chance, to the Vietnamese who had no ambitions of world domination? As for your last remark, you are aware that Ali is a Muslim? Which is apparently a major part of the problem some people have with him, Muslims don't drink alcohol. The story was about Ali doing a really kind thing for two young boys and providing them with a memory and a story and evidence to show and tell their grandchildren. Such is your apparent dislike of the man you can't even accept that at face value without a smart remark. ---------- Post added 10-01-2014 at 11:15 ---------- Harleyman. Just read your comment about Wellington defeating Napoleon with Prussian help. This is an illustration of the lamentable bias in English history teaching. The army which defeated Napoleon at Waterloo was called The Allies, it was known by that name because the original army which took to the field consisted of one third Netherland troops, one third German (from the area we now call Germany) and one third British. The British troops consisted of one third Scots, one third Irish and one third English with a few Welsh. When the Prussian troops under Marshal Blucher joined the fray it meant that 70% of those opposing Napoleon were from the area now known as Germany. Imagine what the Germans think when they hear the English taking credit for the victory. The Duke of Wellington was overall commander and just like you and I Harleyman he was Anglo-Irish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harleyman Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 You are comparing fighting the Nazis, a group who would have brought the entire world under submission given the chance, to the Vietnamese who had no ambitions of world domination? As for your last remark, you are aware that Ali is a Muslim? Which is apparently a major part of the problem some people have with him, Muslims don't drink alcohol. The story was about Ali doing a really kind thing for two young boys and providing them with a memory and a story and evidence to show and tell their grandchildren. Such is your apparent dislike of the man you can't even accept that at face value without a smart remark. ---------- Post added 10-01-2014 at 11:15 ---------- Harleyman. Just read your comment about Wellington defeating Napoleon with Prussian help. This is an illustration of the lamentable bias in English history teaching. The army which defeated Napoleon at Waterloo was called The Allies, it was known by that name because the original army which took to the field consisted of one third Netherland troops, one third German (from the area we now call Germany) and one third British. The British troops consisted of one third Scots, one third Irish and one third English with a few Welsh. When the Prussian troops under Marshal Blucher joined the fray it meant that 70% of those opposing Napoleon were from the area now known as Germany. Imagine what the Germans think when they hear the English taking credit for the victory. The Duke of Wellington was overall commander and just like you and I Harleyman he was Anglo-Irish. I've read a lot on Hitler and his ambitions. I dont think he had any intention to bring the entire world under submission. He planned a Third Reich which would have spread from western Europe across to the Caucasus and which would have supplied him with oil and raw materials as well as giving land to German settlers. He also wanted a grand alliance with Britain. America, (south and north), Africa and Asia he didnt care about. In Asia his ally the Japanese would have been a major trading partner Course Nazism was evil, who could deny it but Stalin and his horrible so called proletarian workers paradise was just as nasty. I was just saying that aside from Nazism Germany was a natural ally of England. Hessian troops fought alongside British redcoats in the American War of Independence and Prussians with England in the seven years war as well as the Napoleonic wars which I already mentioned Prince Albert of Saxe Coburg whom Victoria took for a husband was a man of great vision. It was he who was responsible for the Great Exhibition and he was forward thinking in improving the social welfare of the working classes. He wasnt too popular with Victoria's politicians at first but he was able to win their respect by acting diplomatically and passing on ideas and suggestions of his own in the guise that they were his wife's. Victoria however wasnt too hot in the brain department although she had a fair amount of common sense. I dont dislike Muhammed Ali. That is an exaggeration. I just dont admire him very much except for his boxing ability. As I said previously he could have taken a different course and used his popular standing to work in a more positive manner for black Americans instead os joining an extremist group that believed that equality could be achieved by violence and revolution As for his refusal to be drafted. Well I thought it was wrong. It wasnt all bad for him being a black American. He made a lot of money from white Americans and his problem wasnt with America but ignorant biased people instead. Anyway, he was only one of many draft dodgers, most of whom sought asylum in Canada and the Canadians had no love for them. Little Jimmy Carter pardoned them all eventually. Unlike me, many who answered the call came back with missing arms and legs. I wonder what they must have thought seeing the dodgers come back to their homes all healthy and intact. "We were suckers" must have been one thought ---------- Post added 10-01-2014 at 17:14 ---------- Guys, watch this movie - The Butler with Forest Whitaker when you have time. It can give you an idea of the situation in these troubled years. PS: Can't post the link, because of post count requirements ;/ With a lot of drama added and cobbled up by Oprah Winfrey. I read somewhere that most of it was all made up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjw47 Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 Harleyman. The reason Prince Albert of Saxe Coburg Gotha wasn't popular at first was because he was German. Strange attitude to take, seeing as how Victoria and he were first cousins, they were all Germans! Marrying your first cousin is rightly frowned upon for genetic reasons and is a bit weird in my view. Still it takes all sorts, and the Royals plus their supporters are all a bit weird in my view. Paying unearned respect to the descendents of Thieves, Thugs and Murderers - which is how you get to be 'royal' in the first place - doesn't sit right with me. As for Hitler, do you think he would have left it at that if he had managed to bring the whole of Europe under his control? There is no doubt in my mind that he'd have gone for worldwide dominance. Some of it would be by deals and Treaty's but Germany would have been top dog and called the shots. Anyway, on the 17th of January Muhammad Ali will be 72, and as I'm away for a week in the sun after tomorrow I'll take the opportunity to wish him Happy Birthday now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harleyman Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 Harleyman. The reason Prince Albert of Saxe Coburg Gotha wasn't popular at first was because he was German. Strange attitude to take, seeing as how Victoria and he were first cousins, they were all Germans! Marrying your first cousin is rightly frowned upon for genetic reasons and is a bit weird in my view. Still it takes all sorts, and the Royals plus their supporters are all a bit weird in my view. Paying unearned respect to the descendents of Thieves, Thugs and Murderers - which is how you get to be 'royal' in the first place - doesn't sit right with me. As for Hitler, do you think he would have left it at that if he had managed to bring the whole of Europe under his control? There is no doubt in my mind that he'd have gone for worldwide dominance. Some of it would be by deals and Treaty's but Germany would have been top dog and called the shots. Anyway, on the 17th of January Muhammad Ali will be 72, and as I'm away for a week in the sun after tomorrow I'll take the opportunity to wish him Happy Birthday now. Well enjoy your week mjw47. I wish we could get some rain here. All we are getting are sunny skies and temps in the 70s F Makes me feel guilty seeing all the misery this winter is causing the folks in the mid west and east coast Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjw47 Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 Well enjoy your week mjw47. I wish we could get some rain here. All we are getting are sunny skies and temps in the 70s F Makes me feel guilty seeing all the misery this winter is causing the folks in the mid west and east coast Must be absolutely terrible for you, all that sunshine. I think I can speak for all of us here in Sheffield when I say our hearts bleed. Thanks for the good wishes, will try to enjoy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buck Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 Well enjoy your week mjw47. I wish we could get some rain here. All we are getting are sunny skies and temps in the 70s F Makes me feel guilty seeing all the misery this winter is causing the folks in the mid west and east coast The only time it isn't raining, it's snowing, or worse still the rain is freezing. I think we're having the Super bowl in NJ this year but not sure. That should be a bunch of laughs, especially for the cheerleaders. People who were till recently were friends and family and who live in Florida, are having a lot of fun at our expense, telling us how nice 80 degrees F feels. Florida would be OK if it didn't smell so bloody fetid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harleyman Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 The only time it isn't raining, it's snowing, or worse still the rain is freezing. I think we're having the Super bowl in NJ this year but not sure. That should be a bunch of laughs, especially for the cheerleaders. People who were till recently were friends and family and who live in Florida, are having a lot of fun at our expense, telling us how nice 80 degrees F feels. Florida would be OK if it didn't smell so bloody fetid. There must be some lucky guy whose job is to keep them cheerleaders snug and warm during those freezing games. It was pushing almost 80 here today. The nights still resemble something like winter... California style. Have to keep the central heating on at nights set to 75 F otherwise the house would be down to around a freezing 50 F in the morning They're busy making artificial snow up in the ;ocal mountain ski resorts. When there's no rain down here, there's no snow up there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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