Royal Overspending - Solutions?

[harvey19]

syne.

 

Your way over thinking this in my opinion. Yes, any single individual is pretty powerless against the might of any country's law enforcement.

 

My point however is simply that we all have legal national identities which those of us with documentation can prove quite easily.

 

In the words of that great philosopher Popeye ' I yam what I yam!'

 

Just because we are in another country, our identity doesn't change. We obviously need to obey the laws of the country we are in for purely practical purposes.

 

My point is that I happen to be a citizen of the Republic of Ireland, that remains true wherever I may be.

 

If you hold a British passport then you are a British citizen/subject, wherever you may be.

 

You are not entitled to the same benefits as the local citizens, but they are also not entitled to the protection offered to you by your passport.

If a local gets into trouble with the law he/she are on their own. It's their country and they have to rely on local justice.

 

You however can seek help from your embassy who will intercede on your behalf.

Whether it proves successful or not is another thing. The fact that it applies however proves the point that you are not 'subject' to that country.

 

Were you born in England or Eire ?

If England I presume you could be an English subject and Irish citizen.

[mjw47]

"All men are created equal but some are more equal than others"

 

Calm down, get over the resentment and just learn to live with it.

 

Where did you get the idea that I'm resentful, or less than chilled:cool:? This is a discussion forum where people air their views on various topics.

 

Where I hold a view I like to discuss it, is that alright with you? I have explained that I do not think for one moment that royalty will disappear in this country.

The people are too apathetic and servile for any change. That doesn't bother me in the slightest, why would it?

 

All I like to do is point out the illogical stupidity of continuing with such a nonsensical arrangement.

 

You have no rational argument to back up your obsequious unthinking loyalty to a group of people who consider you inferior to them, so you come up with nonsense.

 

First off I was a Marxist, now I'm resentful and apparently suffering from stress.

 

Why don't you try to come up with a reasoned logical argument as to why this country should continue with the present anachronistic arrangement and we can have an interesting discussion as to the pros and cons?

[Bob England]

Once again you simply do not appear to get it. It's not a question of doing a better job, it's not a question of saving money.

 

It is a question of believing that in this day and age continuing with a system of inherited privilege is wrong and contributes to an ongoing over emphasis on class structure.

 

None royalists usually believe in a meritocracy as opposed to an aristocracy.

 

People should stand on their own feet and prosper by their own talents and efforts.

 

That doesn't mean that no one can inherit the product of their parents or great grandparents success that's all a part of the capitalist system and I for one have no problem with it.

 

But the royals didn't do that did they? Their ancestors didn't invent a new widget and make the world a better place did they?

 

They acquired their wealth and position of power by theft and murder, and, down through the years were responsible for the deaths of millions.

 

And that is not even really the point either. The point is the unearned privilege.

 

The Armed Forces, Police, Judiciary and Politicians all have to take an Oath of allegiance to them despite the fact that all of them including the Crown are paid for be the tax payer.

 

All of these people should swear allegiance to the Country which pays them and for which they owe a duty.

 

Sorry to keep repeating myself but obviously my original point cannot have been very clear.

 

The whole point of a President is that he/she is elected, serves an agreed term and is then replaced.

 

They are not above their fellow citizens they are purely representing their country as it's first citizen equal to all but 'better' than no one.

 

That is how mature, grownup countries do it.

 

No it won't happen here, too servile.

 

OK I get that, but that was not my question, its all very well you expounding on the rights and wrongs of the situation, but we are were we are.

 

Who would you nominate? How about Diddy David Hamilton? Maybe Ken Dodd? They appear to have lived blameless lives (at least neither of them have been arrested for serial groping).

 

What about the great Tony Blair? Germaine Greer?

 

At the end of the day we are as well of with Mrs Windsor, she's got some nice hats and likes corgis. Her son (the one with the ears) seems an inoffensive cove, talks to flowers, married to a horse, what's not to like?

[mjw47]

Were you born in England or Eire ?

If England I presume you could be an English subject and Irish citizen.

 

I was born in Sheffield as was my direct male line traced back to 1706. A fact I, as a proud Sheffielder, am pleased about.

 

However it doesn't work like that. As my mother was Irish, from the County Clare, something I'm also happy with, I was born with the birthright of dual nationality.

 

I chose to take up Irish nationality and have never bothered with the British identity. Should I wish to I could obtain a British one also, and I know two people who hold both. Can't see the point personally, but each to their own.

 

Being a bit pedantic here I know but there's no such thing as an English subject, it's British.

 

There were many reasons why I chose an Irish passport, and that is one of them.

 

You have a British passport, what exactly are you? There are four possibilities.

[harvey19]

I was born in Sheffield as was my direct male line traced back to 1706. A fact I, as a proud Sheffielder, am pleased about.

 

However it doesn't work like that. As my mother was Irish, from the County Clare, something I'm also happy with, I was born with the birthright of dual nationality.

 

I chose to take up Irish nationality and have never bothered with the British identity. Should I wish to I could obtain a British one also, and I know two people who hold both. Can't see the point personally, but each to their own.

 

Being a bit pedantic here I know but there's no such thing as an English subject, it's British.

 

There were many reasons why I chose an Irish passport, and that is one of them.

 

You have a British passport, what exactly are you? There are four possibilities.

 

Even though you haven't a British passport I would think that you would be classed as a British subject because of your place of birth.

I wonder if this country introduced conscription would you be included because of your birth place or would your passport make a difference.

I understand that a person born in Ulster with both parents from there can hold a British and Irish passport.

[mjw47]

OK I get that, but that was not my question, its all very well you expounding on the rights and wrongs of the situation, but we are were we are.

 

Who would you nominate? How about Diddy David Hamilton? Maybe Ken Dodd? They appear to have lived blameless lives (at least neither of them have been arrested for serial groping).

 

What about the great Tony Blair? Germaine Greer?

 

At the end of the day we are as well of with Mrs Windsor, she's got some nice hats and likes corgis. Her son (the one with the ears) seems an inoffensive cove, talks to flowers, married to a horse, what's not to like?

 

Bob, Bob owd lad, there was a time they'd have banged you up in the tower and had your head off for that horse remark!

 

As to who, no idea. Cannot see a problem personally the poulation of the Republic of Ireland is 4.6 million if you include the other six counties approx 6.4 million.

 

Their last four Presidents have been Dr Patrick Hillery, Mary Robinson, Mary McAleese and the current one Michael D Higgins.

 

Everyone a winner. I had the pleasure of meeting Mary McAleese and having a good chat with her and her husband Martin here in Sheffield.

 

The population of the UK is 63.3 million if we can't find someone suitable out of that lot it's time to call it a day.

 

Anyway as I said it's about growing up and getting into the 21st century and getting rid of automatic deference and privilidge rather than anything else.

 

Watch out for a big bloke with a black mask carrying a double edged axe over his shoulder! :o

[Qualtrough]

Really? You think the Prime Minister of this country, or the Queen for that matter, has nothing better to do with their time than carry out a meaningless tradition which takes place every week when Parliament is sitting?

 

By God sir, tis no surprise we lost the Empire!

 

---------- Post added 30-01-2014 at 13:42 ----------

 

 

We are talking about the royal oath, the circumstances are perfectly clear. It is an oath to be loyal to the current monarch and accept them as your sovereign.

 

No 'context' is applicable, it couldn't be simpler.

 

So, does the oath have any meaning?

 

There are plenty of daft traditions, look at Black Rod, the content of the chats with the queen are confidential but if we are to believe the dramatisations she's there to be a sounding board, quite informal. The Cambridge Spies drama showed Blunt telling her he was a gay communist, she didn't mind as long as he looked after her art properly!

[aliceBB]

"All men are created equal but some are more equal than others"

 

 

 

I would be worried if I thought you were offering us that diktat from 'Animal Farm' (where Orwell subverts the original US Declaration phrase to refer to the repressive, fascist, totalitarian state he is satirising in his novel) for our approval as some kind of universal truth.

 

Please explain why you quoted it.

[mjw47]

Even though you haven't a British passport I would think that you would be classed as a British subject because of your place of birth.

I wonder if this country introduced conscription would you be included because of your birth place or would your passport make a difference.

I understand that a person born in Ulster with both parents from there can hold a British and Irish passport.

 

As I've been retired for many years now I don't think I'll get called up . As my father fought in the second War, and my uncle and cousin fought in the First War, I would have had no problem 'doing my bit', it would only be fair, as I have lived most, although not all of my life here.

 

My passport being Irish makes me a citizen of a Republic which means I am not a 'subject'.

 

It does not however, in my opinion, remove my obligation to this country. There's those inconvenient principles again .

[aliceBB]

Her son (the one with the ears) seems an inoffensive cove, talks to flowers, married to a horse, what's not to like?

 

I must object to that in the strongest terms.

 

Swamp-donkey, please!