Fed up of non believers

[janie48]

Really? Considering your example of smoking not being considered harmful as a reason to challenge a scientific theory, I thought you were way off the mark.

You completely missed the point, and assumed I knew nothing about the testing of scientific theories because I mentioned those two examples of previous medical acceptance.

 

I would have thought it was common knowledge to be aware that scientific theories would have had to be thoroughly researched, repeatedly tested and accepted by majority expert opinion before being considered valid.

[Ryedo40]

mjw, can you understand that two protons and two neutrons end up being an helium nucleus; and that two helium nuclei can fuse together giving you a beryllium nucleus. And when another helium nuclei is fused with that, you end up with carbon. And when another helium nucleus fused with carbon, you end up with oxygen.

 

If you get the gist of the above, and when you've got a vast chemical soup, there's going to be numerous combinations giving rise to all sorts of stuff; which in turn give rise to plenty of other stuff.

 

I don't see how it is difficult to comprehend

Edited February 26, 2014 by Ryedo40

[mjw47]

Over 50% of the genes in a human are also present in a cabbage. Don't just consider the animals in that...

 

There may be considerable differences between humans and giraffes, but both are bilateral veterbrates, with quite similar skeletons (giraffes have seven vertebrae in the neck, just like humans) and similar nerves for example (the inferior laryngeal nevre goes down the neck of a huma, round the aorta and back up to the larynx - just like the giraffe although the detour in a giraffe is longer thana human). Indeed you can trace that nerve back as far as sharks and thence back to fish and see how the fish evolved - eventually into land dwellers and thence into mammals...

 

But the strongest indication yet that we are all linked is in DNA - there are many systems that you could use for encoding information, but every single lifeform from sulphur metabolishing bacteria through mushrooms, mosses, plan ts, ferns, redwood trees, the common cabbage, and sharks, fish, salamanders, reptiles, birds and mammals all use DNA to encode hereditable information. About the only thing that doesnt are viruses, and these use RNA instead, and the evolutionary leap from RNA to DNA is an easy one to visualise.

 

 

 

The original creation of a self replicating peptide would have been just that - it would have taken a lot of luck to have them assemble in the correct sequence. But with a pool full of many different organic molecules it wouldnt have taken that long before one did arrive, and then it would have very quickly outcompeted everything else. After that when the first mutuationj came along that was more successful it in it's turn would get outcompeted, and so on it went....

 

Thanks for that, I found it very interesting. Knew about the DNA, apparently we're related to bananas.

 

I think I'm comfortable with the genome thing. Building blocks, and if it's an efficient method it replicates. But why?

 

Why would a non sentient organism possess the desire to replicate? Also, how did the ability to fly come about?

 

I have this mental image of a tiny microorganism which has minute lumps on it's shoulders wiggling them every day, thinking ' It won't do me any good but just wait til my Great Great + 50 million grandchild grows up, they'll soar like an eagle!'

 

Two problems with that of course, first of all his descendants turned out to be mosquito's and second of all he didn't have a brain to think with.

 

If you can provide further insight I'd appreciate it.

[SnailyBoy]

You completely missed the point, and assumed I knew nothing about the testing of scientific theories because I mentioned those two examples of previous medical acceptance.

 

I would have thought it was common knowledge to be aware that scientific theories would have had to be thoroughly researched, repeatedly tested and accepted by majority expert opinion before being considered valid.

 

Actually it's the hypothesis (single or muliple) that is researched, repeatedly tested and accepted before it becomes a theory.

[Ryedo40]

I was raised a Catholic and left the church in my late teens after much thought. The church has- rightly - received bad press over the last few years, however, I have known many truly impressive,genuinely honourable priests and their failure to convince me is probably my loss.

 

I can assure you that at no time did Professor Lemaitre see any conflict between his faith and science.

 

As far as he was concerned the Big Bang happened because God willed it so.

 

I never said he did see any conflict. There are many a good scientist who are capable of compartmentalising the beliefs they hold on faith. The fact still remains that it wasn't his catholic faith that discovered the Big Bang: it was science.

[mjw47]

mjw, can you understand that two protons and two neutrons end up being an helium nucleus; and that two helium nuclei can fuse together giving you a beryllium nucleus. And when another helium nuclei is fused with that, you end up with carbon. And when another helium nucleus fused with carbon, you end up with oxygen.

 

If you get the gist of the above, and when you've got a vast chemical soup, there's going to be numerous combinations giving rise to all sorts of stuff; which in turn give rise to plenty of other stuff.

 

I don't see how it is difficult to comprehend

 

Don't you really? Well may I say how happy I am for you?

[janie48]

Actually it's the hypothesis (single or muliple) that is researched, repeatedly tested and accepted before it becomes a theory.

You're being very precise, but the explanation is appreciated.

[Lockjaw]

What I find the most difficult thing to comprehend about the idea that all life on Earth stems from a primordial liquid, is the incredible variety of species which are claimed to have evolved from this- presumably- identical chemical mixture.

 

It is estimated that there are anything up to 10 million Species of insects alone. When you start to consider all the rest of the species in the world and the incredible differences between them it is hard to accept.

 

Giraffes, Elephants, Swallows, Sharks and Humans all started off as the same mixture?

 

In fairness, although I no longer adhere to any religion you can understand how believers come to the conclusion that there is a creator involved.

It all seems so unbelievable convenient doesn't it? An ecosystem which maintains itself and is interdependent.

 

Not really. There were some conditions and some stuff happened as a result of those conditions.

 

 

some people have difficulty in accepting that it all came about as a pure fluke.

 

Of course. That's why religion started in the first place, isn't it?

[mjw47]

I never said he did see any conflict. There are many a good scientist who are capable of compartmentalising the beliefs they hold on faith. The fact still remains that it wasn't his catholic faith that discovered the Big Bang: it was science.

 

Fair enough, but has it occurred to you that it may have been his faith which inspired him to discover as much as possible about the mind and intentions of God?

 

The Catholic Church possesses one of the most impressive observatory's in the world. It has it's HQ in Castle Gandolfo and an observatory at Mount Graham International Observatory in the USA.

 

Some religions are not incompatible with science, as I pointed out in an earlier post they take the view that if that's the way God wanted to do it, who's going to stop him?

[Maz3]

What I find the most difficult thing to comprehend about the idea that all life on Earth stems from a primordial liquid, is the incredible variety of species which are claimed to have evolved from this- presumably- identical chemical mixture.

 

It is estimated that there are anything up to 10 million Species of insects alone. When you start to consider all the rest of the species in the world and the incredible differences between them it is hard to accept.

 

Giraffes, Elephants, Swallows, Sharks and Humans all started off as the same mixture?

 

Yes, but it happened over a very, very long time. As different groups of organisms were subjected to different conditions, habitats, etc that's when the differences evolved.