Fed up of non believers

[mjw47]

Lockjaw.

 

'He's merely trying to help you understand the meanings of the words you are incorrectly using' 'Gently guide you'

 

Tell me would it be possible for you to be more pompous? Upon reflection I don't believe it would. You have reached pomposity nirvana and may now wear a velvet smoking jacket.

 

You and your cohorts have provided me with amusement in previous posts and here you are again, the gift that keeps on giving.

 

None of you appear to be able to understand the ridiculousness of your posturing.

 

Language is subordinate to thoughts ideas and emotions, but you lot appear to be under the impression that it's the other way around, and if someone cannot be labelled by a definition their position is unacceptable to you.

 

Words change their meaning constantly and unless you are a bit dim you are perfectly well aware of the meaning and intent.

 

Had you told me you were jealous of someones wealth or fame I would have known immediately what you meant because of the context in which you used it.

And that's all the matters in regard to language,understanding. The fact that you and your mates choose to complicate matters by your pedantic nit picking ( yes I used it again, as it is so appropriate ) is your problem.

 

It seems to me that what you and 'Roots' would like would be for you both to be able to pontificate to the rest of the forum whilst we look on with undiluted awe and gratitude.

 

Well unfortunately for you that's not the way it works.

 

Although you and your mates have convinced yourselves that due to your obsession

With definitions you are some kind of intellectual elite on the forum but I have to inform you that some of us are far from being in agreement.

 

---------- Post added 28-02-2014 at 11:57 ----------

 

Lewis Carroll wrote:" "When I use a word," Humpty Dumpty said, in rather a scornful tone, "it means just what I choose it to mean—neither more nor less." "

 

You're setting yourself up as another Humpty.

 

Theism/atheism is to do with belief. Gnosticism/agnosticism is to do with knowledge.

 

This diagram might help...

 

http://lh3.ggpht.com/-q2d4A4N5arw/TmEoB9jCjOI/AAAAAAAAC5k/daRnstnWPJE/Agnostic%252520v%252520Gnostic%252520v%252520Atheist%252520v%252520Theist.png?imgmax=800

 

Everbody is either a theist (having belief in god/God/gods) or an atheist (without a belief in god/God/gods). There is no middle ground

 

 

Correct.

 

 

You're right that is not the same, but you still either believe in god or do not believe in god. There is no middle ground. Think about it.

 

---------- Post added 28-02-2014 at 10:41 ----------

 

True.

 

 

Could do, but not necessarily. Ever heard of that new invention; the telephone. I've had many a heart to heart on Facebook.

 

 

It can be. If you had made clear your intention, I would not have responded in that fashion, nor at all.

 

And here comes another one of the posse.

 

No he was humpty, I stated that the OED definition was as close as it needed to be to describe my position, rather arrogantly in my opinion he chose to disagree.

 

Yes I know, and it is used in agnostic because agnostics believe that the knowledge of the presence, or none presence of God(s) is unobtainable, and thus not worth worrying about.

 

EVERYONE either believes in God or does not believe in God? You are privy to the thoughts and beliefs of every single person on earth? There is no one out there who has absolutely no interest whatsoever, and hasn't given it a passing thought?

 

I am not in the habit of holding personal in depth conversations with people I don't know, and with whom I have a strong suspicion that no friendship would develop.

 

You guys do amuse me, a previous thread we crossed swords on wound up being closed down because one of you, can't remember which, entered a state of almost catatonic fury and appeared to be about to have a stroke.

 

If I recall correctly this was brought about because one of the group had suggested to me, in the arrogant manner which typifies your little gang, that I might learn much by paying attention to his fellow geniuses as ' They had much knowledge and erudition on the subject.'

 

After I had stopped laughing, I pointed out that in my view knowledge on religion or indeed the absence thereof was pointless. As both believers and non believers have no proof of their contentions then all that could be achieved as far as' knowledge' goes would be the regurgitation of myths, fables and unproven theories.

 

As I had received a religious upbringing provided by the original christian church I had no wish to listen to it all over again.

[redwhine]

EVERYONE either believes in God or does not believe in God?

Yes.

 

You are privy to the thoughts and beliefs of every single person on earth?

No.

 

There is no one out there who has absolutely no interest whatsoever, and hasn't given it a passing thought?

There may be millions, but they still either believe in god (unlikely if you consider the premise ) or lack belief in god (much more likely, of course). Anyone who cannot answer yes to the question "Do you believe in god?" is, by default, an atheist, whether they know it or not, or have considered it or not.

 

Can you think of a third option? I can't.

[milquetoast1]

Can you think of a third option? I can't.

 

I would be interested in this third dimension to the binary question too.

 

He seems pretty adamant that he doesn't not believe in god, and yet he doesn't believe either.

[ivanava]

I would be interested in this third dimension to the binary question too.

 

He seems pretty adamant that he doesn't not believe in god, and yet he doesn't believe either.

 

The third dimension is I might believe in God, but until you tell me what it is, I can't say whether I believe or not.

[Lockjaw]

Lockjaw.

 

'He's merely trying to help you understand the meanings of the words you are incorrectly using' 'Gently guide you'

 

Tell me would it be possible for you to be more pompous? Upon reflection I don't believe it would. You have reached pomposity nirvana and may now wear a velvet smoking jacket.

 

You and your cohorts have provided me with amusement in previous posts and here you are again, the gift that keeps on giving.

 

None of you appear to be able to understand the ridiculousness of your posturing.

 

Language is subordinate to thoughts ideas and emotions, but you lot appear to be under the impression that it's the other way around, and if someone cannot be labelled by a definition their position is unacceptable to you.

 

Words change their meaning constantly and unless you are a bit dim you are perfectly well aware of the meaning and intent.

 

Had you told me you were jealous of someones wealth or fame I would have known immediately what you meant because of the context in which you used it.

And that's all the matters in regard to language,understanding. The fact that you and your mates choose to complicate matters by your pedantic nit picking ( yes I used it again, as it is so appropriate ) is your problem.

 

It seems to me that what you and 'Roots' would like would be for you both to be able to pontificate to the rest of the forum whilst we look on with undiluted awe and gratitude.

 

Well unfortunately for you that's not the way it works.

 

Although you and your mates have convinced yourselves that due to your obsession

With definitions you are some kind of intellectual elite on the forum but I have to inform you that some of us are far from being in agreement.

 

---------- Post added 28-02-2014 at 11:57 ----------

 

 

And here comes another one of the posse.

 

No he was humpty, I stated that the OED definition was as close as it needed to be to describe my position, rather arrogantly in my opinion he chose to disagree.

 

Yes I know, and it is used in agnostic because agnostics believe that the knowledge of the presence, or none presence of God(s) is unobtainable, and thus not worth worrying about.

 

EVERYONE either believes in God or does not believe in God? You are privy to the thoughts and beliefs of every single person on earth? There is no one out there who has absolutely no interest whatsoever, and hasn't given it a passing thought?

 

I am not in the habit of holding personal in depth conversations with people I don't know, and with whom I have a strong suspicion that no friendship would develop.

 

You guys do amuse me, a previous thread we crossed swords on wound up being closed down because one of you, can't remember which, entered a state of almost catatonic fury and appeared to be about to have a stroke.

 

If I recall correctly this was brought about because one of the group had suggested to me, in the arrogant manner which typifies your little gang, that I might learn much by paying attention to his fellow geniuses as ' They had much knowledge and erudition on the subject.'

 

After I had stopped laughing, I pointed out that in my view knowledge on religion or indeed the absence thereof was pointless. As both believers and non believers have no proof of their contentions then all that could be achieved as far as' knowledge' goes would be the regurgitation of myths, fables and unproven theories.

 

As I had received a religious upbringing provided by the original christian church I had no wish to listen to it all over again.

 

That response is pretty much exactly as I predicted in a PM to another user on this thread a couple of days ago.

 

Accept it, MJ, some people know more than you about some stuff. There is no shame in learning from them. Insulting them just makes you look silly. The fact that your postings on a thread are showing a repeating pattern: from attempting to engage, to taking issue with reasonable (and wholly correct) comments from others, to hurling the insults, to claiming amusement makes you look rather sad.

 

Having said all that, the mental image of me in a velvet smoking jacket imparting knowledge raised a smile. Perhaps I'll start wearing one for work. It may help me get across the idea of the evolution of the conditions on the planet more effectively, as long as the students don't start calling me a pompous nit picking know it all and pretend to laugh at me because I know a bit more than them.

 

Speaking of which, did you work out what happened to all that water vapour in the atmosphere?

 

---------- Post added 28-02-2014 at 14:22 ----------

 

 

What is with this obsession that some of you have with Mr Smith?

.

 

Could be something to do with, for instance, these:

 

Yes that’s right, so until the term God as a coherent definition I can’t lack a belief in it, because I might not be ignorant of the something that is called God.

 

 

Without the definition of God it wouldn’t be possible to know that nothing can’t be know about God.

 

 

I describe my self as ignostic because whether I believe in God rather depends on the definition of God being used.

 

 

The third dimension is I might believe in God, but until you tell me what it is, I can't say whether I believe or not.

Edited February 28, 2014 by Lockjaw

[salsafan]

...

There may be millions, but they still either believe in god (unlikely if you consider the premise ) or lack belief in god (much more likely, of course). Anyone who cannot answer yes to the question "Do you believe in god?" is, by default, an atheist, whether they know it or not, or have considered it or not.

 

Can you think of a third option? I can't.

Or some people wants to be a believer and then try to continue to be a believer and also question those areas when it happens that God fails them so.

 

Or others can only become a none believer until they experienced something in their life such that they have to become a believer. So this is also possible too.

 

---------- Post added 28-02-2014 at 14:46 ----------

 

Accept it, MJ, some people know more than you about some stuff. There is no shame in learning from them. Insulting them just makes you look silly. The fact that your postings on a thread are showing a repeating pattern: from attempting to engage, to taking issue with reasonable (and wholly correct) comments from others, to hurling the insults, to claiming amusement makes you look rather sad.

But you do realise that this thread is not "knowing about stuff" ? You do realise that, right ?

 

---------- Post added 28-02-2014 at 14:51 ----------

 

...

 

Speaking of which, did you work out what happened to all that water vapour in the atmosphere? ...

By the way, this is actually NOT a mockery. This is true.

 

http://www.masaru-emoto.net/english/hado.html

 

Ugly words and beautiful words affect how water behaves.

If the water vapour had the love of the beautiful cool air of the Antarctic, or the strong affectionate heat of the Safari desert, they then would show their beautiful self in alignment to create a beautiful bond and shape.

The intense vibrational emotions of love (in the form of sound waves, or electromagnetic waves) make the water want to do better and change too.

Edited February 28, 2014 by salsafan

[ivanava]

 

Could be something to do with, for instance, these:

 

Wow you went to all that trouble to find like minded people.

 

I won't bother looking for the members with opinions similar to yours, I have better things to do.

[mjw47]

That response is pretty much exactly as I predicted in a PM to another user on this thread a couple of days ago

 

---------- Post added 28-02-2014 at 14:22 ----------

 

 

 

And there it is, just as I predicted to myself.

 

The last time I came across you lot it was obvious that you like the comfort of a gang.

 

Typical behaviour of the bully boy and coward the world over.

 

Unfortunately for you I don't intimidate that easily in real life, let alone on a forum dealing with keyboard warriors.

 

I also predicted to myself that at least one of you was a teacher, probably at primary school level.

 

The condescending attitude gives it away every time. In the real world away from the classroom you need to rein it in a little don't you?

 

But here, with the anonymity the internet provides you can be your real self a self regarding preening man.

 

When have I ever claimed to know more than anyone else? Not accepting the words of wisdom of your mates and you without question doesn't equate to saying I know better, simply that I don't necessarily agree with your viewpoint.

 

I assume that you don't particularly encourage debate amongst your students?

 

One long diatribe from old know it all is probably their lot, poor sods.

 

As for pointing out that you and your fellow travelers amuse me, I was raised to tell the truth and the truth is that you do, very much.

[ivanava]

And there it is, just as I predicted to myself.

 

The last time I came across you lot it was obvious that you like the comfort of a gang.

 

Typical behaviour of the bully boy and coward the world over.

 

Unfortunately for you I don't intimidate that easily in real life, let alone on a forum dealing with keyboard warriors.

 

I also predicted to myself that at least one of you was a teacher, probably at primary school level.

 

The condescending attitude gives it away every time. In the real world away from the classroom you need to rein it in a little don't you?

 

But here, with the anonymity the internet provides you can be your real self a self regarding preening man.

 

When have I ever claimed to know more than anyone else? Not accepting the words of wisdom of your mates and you without question doesn't equate to saying I know better, simply that I don't necessarily agree with your viewpoint.

 

I assume that you don't particularly encourage debate amongst your students?

 

One long diatribe from old know it all is probably their lot, poor sods.

 

As for pointing out that you and your fellow travelers amuse me, I was raised to tell the truth and the truth is that you do, very much.

 

Now this I can agree with.

[Lockjaw]

Now this I can agree with.

 

Is this the bit where I start to whine because you are all ganging up on me?

 

 

 

ivanava: you are mrsmith, maxmaximus and angos. You know it and we know it.

 

mjw: look at the insults you are hurling around, the accusations you are making, and then look at the manner in which you are hurling them. Yes, it's like looking in a mirror, isn't it?

 

salsafan: you're just a nutter, love.

Edited February 28, 2014 by Lockjaw