janie48 Posted April 2, 2014 Share Posted April 2, 2014 You need to come up with a contrary and plausible alternative rather then seek to denigrate and belittle opinions contrary to your own.You need to come up with a plausible explanation for supporting the death penalty other then comparing us with China. Capital punishment is a relic of the past in this country and will remain so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruprecht1st Posted April 2, 2014 Share Posted April 2, 2014 No I don't. You called it "clear proof". It isn't clear proof. It's an anecdote. Write a thousand words. Truth is still true. I agree, truth will out. ---------- Post added 02-04-2014 at 12:26 ---------- You need to come up with a plausible explanation for supporting the death penalty other then comparing us with China. Capital punishment is a relic of the past in this country and will remain so. It will, the population of this country, made up as it is, of wooly liberal do gooders with the moral fibre of an amoeba will fail to address the issue until it is too late. Regarding providing a plausible reason for the re introduction of capital punishment, I notice that when people ask me this question they fail to come up with a plausible explanation as to why we should tolerate the presence of murderers, rapists, pedophiles, robbers burglars thieves etc. Please enlighten me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivanava Posted April 2, 2014 Share Posted April 2, 2014 I agree, truth will out. ---------- Post added 02-04-2014 at 12:26 ---------- It will, the population of this country, made up as it is, of wooly liberal do gooders with the moral fibre of an amoeba will fail to address the issue until it is too late. Regarding providing a plausible reason for the re introduction of capital punishment, I notice that when people ask me this question they fail to come up with a plausible explanation as to why we should tolerate the presence of murderers, rapists, pedophiles, robbers burglars thieves etc. Please enlighten me. They can't, they are more concerned about the welfare of criminals than they are about the welfare of victims. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris_Sleeps Posted April 2, 2014 Share Posted April 2, 2014 they fail to come up with a plausible explanation as to why we should tolerate the presence of murderers, rapists, pedophiles, robbers burglars thieves etc. We don't tolerate them. We put them in prison. I find it sad that this thread is about denying prisoners books, and now has moved on to denying them oxygen. It shows the sadism involved in some people's thinking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrs brady Posted April 2, 2014 Share Posted April 2, 2014 This caught my attention this week: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-26726864 Any prisoner studying for an FE/HE course or specialist interest is stuffed, basically. Forgive me if I'm being a 'fickle' But I'd of thought anyone who was imprisoned,would immediately waiver their rights to any home comforts including bettering themselves academically. They had the choice to do that before they turned to crime etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivanava Posted April 2, 2014 Share Posted April 2, 2014 We don't tolerate them. We put them in prison. I find it sad that this thread is about denying prisoners books, and now has moved on to denying them oxygen. It shows the sadism involved in some people's thinking. Until they are released to commit more murders, rapes, theft, violence and other crimes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aliceBB Posted April 2, 2014 Author Share Posted April 2, 2014 Regarding providing a plausible reason for the re introduction of capital punishment, I notice that when people ask me this question they fail to come up with a plausible explanation as to why we should tolerate the presence of murderers, rapists, pedophiles, robbers burglars thieves etc. Please enlighten me. We do not 'tolerate their presence' in society - if they are convicted of these crimes then they are incarcerated. There is no intelligent argument for re-introducing capital punishment in the UK. The only reason people want it is for revenge. Some relatives of victims of murder understandably say at times they wish it were brought back, but our legal system is not based on vengefulness and I hope it never is. Here are a few reasons not to, for anyone who's never got further than the Daily Mail's take on this. It has not been shown to be a deterrent to other would-be offenders; it is morally indefensible to inflict a barbaric punishment on another human being since that brings the authority doing the inflicting to the moral level of the offender (if you are saying murder is wrong, then you cannot condone execution either); miscarriages of justice which do happen) are impossible to remedy when the wronged person has been executed. Perhaps above all it makes us less human, or certainly less civilised, if our answer to wrongdoing or violence in others is to put them to death. You have to protect society from them, of course you do. But if you can reform them (and education, books, etc., are crucial here) isn't that more worthwhile and a greater test of how strong a society we have? It's ironic that those very people who moan and shriek about 'Islamic'/Sharia Law being 'imposed on us' and how Britain - a 'Christian country' - is being 'taken over' by an alien morality and culture, are the ones who would like to see barbaric corporal and capital punishments brought back. Very Christian! WTFWJD?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris_Sleeps Posted April 2, 2014 Share Posted April 2, 2014 But I'd of thought anyone who was imprisoned,would immediately waiver their rights to any home comforts including bettering themselves academically. You can't waiver rights. You have them, as a right. Further to the point, do you not consider prison a great opportunity to do something to better oneself? It'd be a damn shame to send a man home as ignorant and as unemployable as when he entered prison. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ivanava Posted April 2, 2014 Share Posted April 2, 2014 It has not been shown to be a deterrent to other would-be offenders; Yes it has. it is morally indefensible to inflict a barbaric punishment on another human beingNo it isn't since that brings the authority doing the inflicting to the moral level of the offender (if you are saying murder is wrong, then you cannot condone execution either); No it doesn't miscarriages of justice which do happen) are impossible to remedy when the wronged person has been executed. That can only be used as a defense against executing some murders, but some will never be found innocent no matter how many appeals they make. Perhaps above all it makes us less human, or certainly less civilised, if our answer to wrongdoing or violence in others is to put them to death. No it doesn't. You have to protect society from them, of course you do. Which we consistently fail to do. But if you can reform them (and education, books, etc., are crucial here) isn't that more worthwhile and a greater test of how strong a society we have?They've been trying that for decades and it hasn't worked, 70% reoffending rate from some prisons and a significantly higher reoffending rate than China. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aliceBB Posted April 2, 2014 Author Share Posted April 2, 2014 Forgive me if I'm being a 'fickle' But I'd of thought anyone who was imprisoned,would immediately waiver their rights to any home comforts including bettering themselves academically. They had the choice to do that before they turned to crime etc. No, in many cases they did not. The literacy level of convicted prisoners is woeful. These are not old Etonians, ffs. Yes, in theory, everyone has the right to a free education in this country. But it would be naive to assume everyone has the home background which helps them make the most of it. A high proportion of male prisoners grew up with no decent male role model in their life. A high proportion truanted from school or were excluded many times. You have to see the wider context of offending before you can say what chances they had (or lacked) before they 'turned to crime'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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